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Subject: Re: [trans-ws] ISO codes and RAND
Hi, Firstly please find attached the UBL proposal regarding schemas for sharing the validation common codes like ISO 3166. I wholly agree with the submission of INCITS to ISO/ANSI. Quite honestly I consider this type of move extremely worrying and will lead, if carried out, to the demise of the use of ISO/ANSI codes and the creation of an independent and free coding system under the auspices of say OASIS or ECMA. Reading the newsletter quote it is unclear whether reproduction by a standards organization such as OASIS/Lisa would incur any potential liability as it is not for direct commercial gain. The codes would not be part of a product, but merely reproduced to insure conformance. The approach to these matters by OASIS is in any case "RAND", so adopting the codes would be within the guidelines given by OASIS. Regards, AZ Arle Lommel wrote: > This is the information I have on this topic. I don't know a whole lot more. > > -Arle > > -----Original Message----- > From: Jennifer DeCamp [mailto:firstname.lastname@example.org] > Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2003 5:46 PM > To: Michael Anobile > Subject: Letter from INCITS > > in031008 > > > August 1, 2003 > > > > INCITS CONTRIBUTION TO ANSI CONCERNING THE AVAILABILITY OF ISO CODES > > > FROM: INCITS Executive Board > > SUBJECT: Availability of ISO Codes > > INCITS wishes to express its concern over recent positions taken by > ANSI and by the ISO CPSG with respect to ISO 3166, ISO 4217 and ISO 639, > in particular ISO 3166, Country Codes. In brief, the issue is whether > ANSI or other ISO national bodies, or ISO itself, should charge royalty > fees for the use of the standard, in addition to a standard copyright > fee for purchase or reproduction of the standard. In ANSI's on-line > newsletter for May 2003, ANSI reported that: > > "The CPSG also discussed the ISO 3166 country codes, ISO 4217 > currencycodes, and ISO 639 language codes and proposed > clarifications for their distribution. Noting the necessity for a > number of ISO standards to be published as databases, the CPSG > asked that the Secretary General recommend a consideration of the > publciation of some ISO standards as such, and promoted studying > related pricing, delivery, and maintenance issues. > > > "CPSG Recommendation: CPSG considered the ambiguity between > reproducing of data elements from ISO 3166, 4217 and 6349 for the > purpose of implementation and for commercial exploitation and > proposed the following clarifications: > > > > * The reproduction of the full standard shall follow the normal > copyright rules > * No copyright fee shall be charged for the reproduction of the > 2 digit codes of ISO 3166, 4217 and 639 lists in books, > magazines, acadeic work and for internal use by companies, > institutes and organization > * Software developers or commercial resellers requesting > permission to embed ISO codes in their products for resale > will be asked to purchase each code in electronic format and > pay either an annual fee or a one time fee and any applicable > maintenance fees required (to be further discussed with CPSG > by correspondence)" > > The final point has been amplified by ANSI in a summary on use of the > ISO codes as: > > "Companies who develop software products for sale to other parties > are adding value to their products by including the data elements > from an ISO Code in proper applications ...via the sale of the > product the developing company is not only being compensated for > its direct efforts to incorporate the ISO Codes in apropriate > locations but it is also being compensated for trhe value the ISO > Codes have added to its product. The ISO community should also be > compensated for providing the intellectual property required to > incorporate the value-added features into the product." > > While this raises many debatable issues, INCITS' overriding concern is > that this represents a radical departure from established practice with > respect to standards. We are not concerned here with the fees > collected by many standards setting organizations for purchasing copies > of standards. Rather, the proposal being discussed would in effect > place a charge upon implementing a standard by enforcing a fee > associated with each copy of a product built according to or > incorporating the standard. In essence, therefore, this charges users > of a standard, be they direct (in the case of manufacturers) or > indirect (in the case of product consumers) to actually use the standard. > > In INCITS' opinion this would constitute a strong disincentive for > manufacturers, large consumers and consumer groups to develop standards > within standards organizations which might adopt this process or to > subsequently make use of the standards in their products and services. > Standards participants, whether manufacturers, consumers, government > agencies or other entities, bring their own information to the > standards development process so that they can share in the resultant > standard. In other words, standards participants have the expectation > that in exchange for their "valuable and volunteer" contributions, they > will be able to "use" the fruits of their consensus-building process > without further hindrance. > > In the Information Technology industry, where many consortia and > alternative standards-setting models to the formal standards > development process already flourish, INCITS believes that the > imposition of such usage fees would be likely to drive participation in > standards development away from organizations which implement them. At > the very least standards participants would probably adjust their > priorities for involvement as a result. > > Accordingly, INCITS requests the ANSI ICO Council to > > 1. Adopt a position that fees for using the contents of standards, as > opposed to fees for the purchase of the standards themselves, is > inappropriate > 2. Ensure that ANSI does not go forward with such a policy > 3. Take this issue forward to ISO Council in the strongest possible > terms to dissuade ISO and its members from this approach and from > ISO policy > > > > > > ------ End of Forwarded Message -- -- email - email@example.com smail - Mr. A.Zydron 24 Maybrook Gardens, High Wycombe, Bucks HP13 6PJ Mobile +(44) 7966 477181 FAX +(44) 870 831 8868 www - http://www.azdata-products.com This message contains confidential information and is intended only for the individual named. If you are not the named addressee you may not disseminate, distribute or copy this e-mail. Please notify the sender immediately by e-mail if you have received this e-mail by mistake and delete this e-mail from your system. E-mail transmission cannot be guaranteed to be secure or error-free as information could be intercepted, corrupted, lost, destroyed, arrive late or incomplete, or contain viruses. 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