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Subject: Re: [ubl-dev] Low level versioning


Just in case anyone is having trouble finding a UID amongst
the annotation documentations in UBL, UBL uses ISO 11179 via
ISO 15000-5 (CCTS) rules to create 'Dictionary Entry Names'
which are there in the documented schemas (those in the 'xsd'
directory http://docs.oasis-open.org/ubl/cd-UBL-1.0/xsd/
rather than the 'xsdrt' dircectory). These are deemed to be
suitable (pretty much by definition) as unique identifiers
(UIDs) for UBL's complex types.

Steve



Quoting Fraser Goffin <goffinf@googlemail.com>:

> David,
>
> forgive my ignorance of both CAM and UBL. I'm not sure what a UID is
> but for now I'll assume its an identifier for a business entity or
> aggreate (or any type which is versionable - single element ?) in UBL
> and these UIDs can be associated with processing rule in CAM (template
> ?).
>
> How does a user of a service defined by UBL constructs 'know' what UID
> (or version attribute value) to use to assert the version of each type
> (in a composite message containing many such particles) that they want
> to use. And doesn't this raise the bar somewhat for consumer apps ?
>
> Does that fact that there many be multi versions of a business
> transaction in use concurrently each potentially containing differing
> versions of contained types, make this problem any more difficult ?
>
> Fraser.
>
>
>
> On 17/05/06, David RR Webber (XML) <david@drrw.info> wrote:
>> Joe,
>>
>> Your suggestion mirrors the approach CAM is using - in that CAM allows
>> you to associate UID values and sub-version those - accordingly
>> (sub-versioning is critical BTW - allows notion of "use latest always"
>> as well as calling out descreet point items - and ebXML registry
>> supports LID for this).
>>
>> However - no re-assembly from parts is needed - the CAM approach
>> overlays directly on existing artefacts - which is a big plus - because
>> you can version existing instances and schemas in-situ without having to
>> change them or the method(s) you use to complete them.
>>
>> Likewise the UID references can optionally point to semantic content
>> stored in the ebXML registry - either as XSD fragments - or using the
>> XML noun semantic storage format devised for this purpose.  Or - you
>> can use standalone techniques in the template - without needing the
>> registry.
>>
>> Clearly you can also use the registry to directly link UID reference to
>> namespace item labelling too - providing means to bridge between both
>> needs.  This would be a nice way to group UIDs belonging to a ns
>> release.
>>
>> So - essentially the versioning mechanism becomes an overlay layer
>> through the use of the CAM template.
>>
>> Thanks, DW
>>
>> p.s. BTW - this clears this up for me - I thought you were wanting to
>> use the registry to store information about the namespaces - eg a CMS
>> function!!  That is clearly another very obvious use case...
>>
>>
>>  -------- Original Message --------
>> Subject: RE: [ubl-dev] Low level versioning
>> From: "Chiusano Joseph" <chiusano_joseph@bah.com>
>> Date: Wed, May 17, 2006 11:04 am
>> To: "David RR Webber (XML)" <david@drrw.info>, "Fraser Goffin"
>> <goffinf@googlemail.com>
>> Cc: "UBL-Dev" <ubl-dev@lists.oasis-open.org>, "XML-Dev Mailing list"
>> <xml-dev@lists.xml.org>
>>
>> This seems like an opportune time to mention the "Namespace Manager"
>> feature proposal[1] that I sent to the OASIS ebXML Registry TC in
>> January 2002 (I try to bring it up about once or twice a year, to remind
>> folks that it's still out there;)
>>
>> With such a feature, one could register in an ebXM Registry
>> implementation the namespace that each construct
>> (element/attribute/datatype) is associated with, as well as the
>> constructs themselves, with an association between constructs and
>> namespaces. Then, if a schema were to be constructed (assembled) at
>> design time using a UBL schema (perhaps retreived in its entirety, as a
>> "blob" so to speak) and custom (non-UBL) constructs, the resulting
>> schema can reflect the proper versions of the constructs via their
>> namespaces.
>>
>> I've just set myself an electronic reminder to bring this up again
>> sometime, somewhere, this November ;)
>>
>> Joe
>>
>> [1] http://xml.coverpages.org/namespaces.html
>> (search on "namespace manager", or go right to
>> http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/regrep/200201/msg00061.html to see
>> the archived proposal)
>>
>> Kind Regards,
>> Joseph Chiusano
>> Associate
>> Booz Allen Hamilton
>>
>> 700 13th St. NW, Suite 1100
>> Washington, DC 20005
>> O: 202-508-6514
>> C: 202-251-0731
>> Visit us online@ http://www.boozallen.com
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: David RR Webber (XML) [mailto:david@drrw.info]
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 10:12 AM
>> To: Fraser Goffin
>> Cc: UBL-Dev; XML-Dev Mailing list
>> Subject: RE: [ubl-dev] Low level versioning
>>
>> Fraser,
>>
>> I very much believe versioning is needed to the element/attribute level
>> in an operational environment and using OASIS CAM this is very much
>> attainable / essential.
>>
>> Therefore I'd pro-offer - if this is a key business need - then you can
>> use CAM templates to overlay this fine level of detail over the base UBL
>> schema between you are your partners.
>>
>> As for UBL itself - since the version only changes periodically - on a
>> major release schedule - then the course grained ns approach is probably
>> sufficient.
>>
>> DW
>>
>>
>>
>> -------- Original Message --------
>> Subject: [ubl-dev] Low level versioning
>> From: "Fraser Goffin" <goffinf@googlemail.com>
>> Date: Wed, May 17, 2006 10:00 am
>> To: UBL-Dev <ubl-dev@lists.oasis-open.org>,  "XML-Dev Mailing list"
>> <xml-dev@lists.xml.org>
>>
>> There has been some recent discussion in my organisation as to whether
>> there is a need to provide verion information for each element/aggregate
>> in our standard data model.
>>
>> Currently versioning is only visible to implementers on the business
>> transaction level schema (namespace), that is, individual parts are not
>> individually versioned.
>>
>> Does UBL provide individual version information for each business
>> entity, and are each of these visible when entities are combined to form
>> a business transaction ?
>>
>> I have a feeling that traceability to the core data model needs to
>> reflect version, but I remain to be convinced about whether it is
>> necessary at this level at run-time.
>>
>> All opinions welcome.
>>
>> Fraser.
>>
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>>
>
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