RE: [ws-rx-editors] RE: Stable/latest url for issue list

["Patil, Sanjay" <sanjay.patil@sap.com>]

I am pretty sure Marc and Robin are figuring out a good solution for us,
but I am a bit lost here in the deails. So I am puttig forth my
requirements questions below. Hopefully these are met ...

A> Would there be a stable URL that can be bookmarked?
B> Would the TC have access to all the previous versions?
C> Can the metadata of the latest version (date, notes) be accessed via
the stable URL?
D> Would there be an email notification sent to the group when a new
version is updated?

Thanks,
Sanjay

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Marc Goodner [mailto:mgoodner@microsoft.com] 
> Sent: Thursday, Oct 20, 2005 8:27 AM
> To: Robin Cover
> Cc: ws-rx-editors@lists.oasis-open.org; Mary McRae; Jamie 
> Clark; Robin Cover
> Subject: [ws-rx-editors] RE: Stable/latest url for issue list
> 
> OK, so the idea of linking from docs.oasis to the Kavi files 
> won't work.
> Oh well, I should have figured or you would have suggested it.
> 
> I'm happy with going forward with -nnn numbering of the files for the
> issue list at http://docs.oasis-open.org/ws-rx/issues/ 
> 
> I suggest we give it a dry run with the issue list update 
> after today's
> call. I'll post to Kavi and pass the files to Robin as well. 
> We can then
> make a recommendation at next week's call to move to the new location.
> That would give the TC members something to review so they can make an
> informed decision.
> 
> Does anyone here object or should we go ahead with this?
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Robin Cover [mailto:robin@oasis-open.org] 
> Sent: Wednesday, October 19, 2005 7:05 PM
> To: Marc Goodner
> Cc: ws-rx-editors@lists.oasis-open.org; Mary McRae; Jamie Clark; Robin
> Cover
> Subject: Re: Stable/latest url for issue list
> 
> On Wed, 19 Oct 2005, Marc Goodner wrote:
> 
> > Hey guys.
> > Robin has graciously offered to help get a stable/latest url for the
> > issue list. In discussing this I realized there were some things I
> > shouldn't unilaterally decide on my own on this.
> 
> Marc is referring to an informal/unofficial memo I sent on 10/12
> (copied to Jamie Clark [Staff Contact] and Mary McRae ['Manager of the
> docs-DOT web server' at http://docs.oasis-open.org/], after I noted
> a fourth TC posting documenting the need for a stable/latest URL 
> corresponding to the WS-RX TC's issues list [1].
> 
> Because Kavi creates URIs containing (unpredictable) magic numbers
> of the shape /download.php/14939/MinutesWSRX-101305.htm, we can't
> support (fixed/stable) "latest version" URIs, and we cannot exploit
> aliasing via symbolic links:
> 
> * the magic number or key (e.g. 14939) is actually the only relevant
> part
>   (albeit a crufty technology artifact that has no semantic value)
> * 'download.php' is just the PHP query code
> * the final portion (e.g., MinutesWSRX-101305.htm) is totally
>   superfluous/unnecessary --  you can substitute anything
>   silly in its place (veronicasSecret.png), or nothing at all
> 
> Some of us have little interest trying to build on this Kavi model
> of file naming and document storage.  By contrast, the repository at 
> http://docs.oasis-open.org/ is based upon a file system with
> filenames/URIs under our complete control.
> 
> In this context, we can also support the notion of "latest version"
> filename/URI by making use of a symlink, linked to each (successive)
> version, as we have implemented for the XACML References:
> 
> http://docs.oasis-open.org/xacml/xacmlRefs.html  
> ['xacmlRefs.html' is a
> symlink]
> http://docs.oasis-open.org/xacml/references/  [version-specific URIs, 
>   latest in directory is the target of the symlink]
> 
> We can do the same for the WS-RX TC's issues list, e.g., with the
> fixed URI matching your choice, as in [what Marc said]:
> 
> http://docs.oasis-open.org/ws-rx/issues/ReliableMessagingIssues.xml
> 
> > The location would be at http://docs.oasis-open.org/ws-rx so we need
> to
> > make the call as to how it is linked to the latest file there.
> > Particularly as there are a number of supporting files like 
> the schema
> > and xsl (which also need stable uris). So my suggestion would be the
> > following (based on Robin's of course).
> > 
> > Get a subdirectory called issues, place all files there and 
> symlink to
> > latest version as the base filename, i.e. 
> ReliableMessagingIssues.xml.
> > So far so good, I don't think any of this is contentious. The
> challenge
> > is we'll need to version the filename, so what are people's opinion?
> > Follow the same convention as the TC docs, i.e. -nn where 
> nn = nn + 1
> > for each revision?
> 
> We can implement whatever you want: -nn works well, or -nnn if you
> think you'll ever get to 100 :-)
> 
> > 
> > Note this is not an automated process. Robin has offered to take on
> the
> > burden of placing these files there whenever they are 
> updated. Which I
> > guess now I see another option. Should we just keep using Kavi and
> setup
> > symlinks to each new version posted there? Would that be possible
> Robin?
> 
> I can ask the IT department (again), but the answer we have received
> more
> than once is that we canNOT make use of symlink in connection 
> with Kavi
> resources.  We could probably use DNS+HTTP redirect from the docs-DOT
> repository (from http://docs.oasis-open.org/ws-rx/<whatever> ) but
> that's 
> not a good option: redirect involves a second server request, and the 
> address that's displayed in a Web browser's address window 
> would be the
> versioned URI such as you now have. e.g.,
> 
> http://www.oasis-open.org/committees/download.php/14894/Reliab
> leMessagin
> gIssues.xml
> 
> You probably want people to bookmark the fixed/stable URI, but that
> won't happen, as HTTP redirect will leave the Kavi versioned
> URI as the bookmarkable address.  So I don't recommend HTTP redirect
> in this context.
> 
> Apparently we can't get access to a real device on the Kavi 
> file system
> because the 'download.php/<magicNumber>' is masking some horribly
> ugly string that's not meant for human eyes, and not intended as
> a regular user file, etc.
> 
> We are in the process of automating support for "latest version" on
> the docs-DOT repository, and giving TCs the ability to create
> their own files/symlinks on that system.  It will probably be rolled
> out in stages, the first of which would be via SSH/SCP (a kind of
> "secure FTP" which also permits you to create your own symlinks).
> Work in progress.
> 
> I stand by my offer to help in the interim, if you want.
> 
> **Mary/Jamie, please correct this if I've not conveyed things
> accurately.
> 
> Unofficially,
> Robin Cover
> 
> > 
> > Regards,
> > 
> > Marc g
> 
> [1] TC requests for persistent URL
> 
> [i]
> http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/ws-rx-editors/200507/msg0
> 0010.html
> July 20, 2005 - "Persistent urls for documents" - I need a persistent
> URL for the issue list for our TC, and ideally any document 
> uploaded to
> the
> document store. The problem is that without a persistent url the old
> links
> will remain in email archives etc. and people will not get the current
> issues list (or other document). This problem gets worse in 
> that I have
> uploaded schemas and xsl that format that list. Those will change less
> often but without persistent urls for those I have a lot more work to
> do to update the issue list.
> 
> [ii]
> http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/ws-rx-editors/200509/msg0
> 0090.html
> September 28, 2005 - Maybe this was already answered but I don't
> immediately see a response. It is not true that adding a document with
> the same name keeps the url the same. It is actually a huge pain that
> it doesn't, I'd prefer to give a url for a specific version and have
> one be the latest like at W3C but that is not how Kavi works. Kavi
> creates an id for each document revision that becomes part of the url.
> So every time you update a doc there you get a new url, same name or
> not.
> 
> [iii]
> http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/ws-rx-editors/200509/msg0
> 0020.html
> [September 18, 2005 message responded to by Marc Goodner] "However,
> there is a problem. The document name stays the same. My
> understanding/assumption was that we will have individual URLs and
> identifiers that reflect the version numbers. This is easily solved
> with the cvs, but not here..."
> 
> [iv]
> http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/ws-rx-editors/200510/msg0
> 0033.html
> Marc Goodner October 12, 2005 "I try to update the issue list 
> soon after
> the minutes come out (with varying success). I will not agree 
> to update
> the issue list this any more often than this as things stand today. I
> actually try not to update it more than this since it always 
> changes the
> URI of the issue list. If we can get a stable URI to the issue list I
> could agree to do incremental updates in addition to the one after the
> call. That would also make it a lot easier to share the responsibility
> so that other editors can move their items from pending to done when
> they update a draft with a resolution without making everyone 
> in the TC
> wonder if they have the latest version of the issue list. So what's
> going on with CVS? Is that our answer for getting a stable URI and
> making this thing easier to update?
> 
>