RE: [ws-rx] Draft teleconf minutes for 18 August 2005

["Gilbert Pilz" <Gilbert.Pilz@bea.com>]

+1 to recording the minutes. Writing them down, especially on a concall
where you can't actually see who is talking, is pretty painfull. If we
recorded the minutes we could pretend to be hip podcasters and all that
. . . 

- g 

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Abbie Barbir [mailto:abbieb@nortel.com] 
> Sent: Friday, August 19, 2005 7:53 AM
> To: Christopher B Ferris; ws-rx@lists.oasis-open.org
> Subject: RE: [ws-rx] Draft teleconf minutes for 18 August 2005
> 
> 
> 
> Basically, person X should be able to ensure that the minutes 
> reflect what he/she said.
> 
> Of course, you can solve all the problems by having the 
> minutes recorded.
> This also solves the problem of appointing a scribe.
> 
> Cheers,
> Abbie
> 
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Christopher B Ferris [mailto:chrisfer@us.ibm.com]
> > Sent: Friday, August 19, 2005 10:22 AM
> > To: ws-rx@lists.oasis-open.org
> > Subject: RE: [ws-rx] Draft teleconf minutes for 18 August 2005
> > 
> > 
> > Ultimately, it is the TC that has responsibility for approving the 
> > minutes. If someone requests a change, and the rest of the TC 
> > disagrees with that change (revisionist history), then IMO 
> it should 
> > not be made.
> > 
> > Personally, I would tend to give the benefit of the doubt to the 
> > person to whom scribed notes are attributed. Thus far, I 
> haven't seen 
> > any changes requested that are inconsistent with my recollection of 
> > what was said on the call.
> > 
> > As long as the requested changes are recorded on the email 
> list, that 
> > should be more than adequate as a record of what was changed. If 
> > someone chooses to take exception to a requested change, 
> they should 
> > do so on the list so that it can be discussed and reconciled in 
> > accordance to the TC's wishes during the approval of the minutes.
> > 
> > Maybe we should all be prefacing our spoken points during a meeting 
> > with:
> > "permission
> > to revise and extend my remarks for the record?" :-)
> > 
> > Cheers,
> > 
> > Christopher Ferris
> > STSM, Emerging e-business Industry Architecture
> > email: chrisfer@us.ibm.com
> > blog: http://webpages.charter.net/chrisfer/blog.html
> > phone: +1 508 377 9295
> > 
> > "Abbie Barbir" <abbieb@nortel.com> wrote on 08/19/2005 09:55:06 AM:
> > 
> > > 
> > > Ashok,
> > > 
> > > History (views, reasons, etc..) changes(or can be rewritten) (it 
> > > depends on who is recording it, have you read history books
> > in other
> > > countries.
> > > 
> > > Having an amendment as you describe means whatever the
> > scirbe misheard
> > > or misrecoreded will be documented regardless of what X has
> > stated on
> > > the call, which should not be the case.
> > > 
> > > Cheers,
> > > Abbie
> > > 
> > > 
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: Ashok Malhotra [mailto:ashok.malhotra@oracle.com]
> > > > Sent: Friday, August 19, 2005 9:36 AM
> > > > To: Paul Cotton; Gilbert Pilz
> > > > Cc: ws-rx@lists.oasis-open.org
> > > > Subject: RE: [ws-rx] Draft teleconf minutes for 18 August 2005
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > Changing minutes can come close to rewriting history.
> > > > In this case, it is possible that the scribe misheard or 
> > > > misrecorded Paul's words but, in the general case, someone can 
> > > > assert a different position to what was taken on the telcon.
> > > > 
> > > > I recommend, therefore, that the minutes not be changed but an 
> > > > amendment record be added saying "X has requested the following 
> > > > changes to the minutes ...".
> > > > 
> > > > All the best, Ashok
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > From: Paul Cotton [mailto:pcotton@microsoft.com]
> > > > > Sent: Friday, August 19, 2005 5:12 AM
> > > > > To: Gilbert Pilz
> > > > > Cc: ws-rx@lists.oasis-open.org
> > > > > Subject: RE: [ws-rx] Draft teleconf minutes for 18 August 2005
> > > > > 
> > > > > Thanks for taking the minutes.  Here are some 
> proposed changes:
> > > > > 
> > > > > 1.  Paul: David spoke directly about some discussions 
> that took 
> > > > > place during (prior?) the forming of the charter. I
> > wouldn't have
> > > > > permitted this (missed some of this)
> > > > > 
> > > > > Please replace this with:
> > > > > 
> > > > > > >Paul: David spoke directly about some discussions 
> that took 
> > > > > > >place
> > > > > prior to the formation of the TC.  I want to make it 
> clear that 
> > > > > Microsoft never would have suggested that the charter 
> could be 
> > > > > changed since this is known to be against OASIS rules.
> > > > > 
> > > > > 2. >Paul: I'm going to vote against this. It will
> > divert the TCs
> > > > > resources into a non-normative, non-exhaustive doc who's 
> > > > > applicability to the work of the TC is unclear.
> > > > > 
> > > > > Please replace this with what I put into the Chat 
> dialogue and 
> > > > > which I read out:
> > > > > 
> > > > > >Paul: I am going to vote against this proposal since it
> > > > > recommends the
> > > > > TC work on a non-normative, undecided scope, non-exhaustive 
> > > > > non-deliverable.
> > > > > 
> > > > > 3. >Paul: I won't disagree with you. I take it you are
> > referring
> > > > > to XQuery? That effort started with a blank slate. This
> > TC started
> > > > > with completed specs as well as interop scenarios. I 
> think this 
> > > > > effort is beyond the need for use cases.
> > > > > 
> > > > > Please replace this with the following (I never used the word
> > > > > "completed"):
> > > > > 
> > > > > Paul: I won't disagree with you. I take it you are 
> referring to 
> > > > > XQuery? That effort started with a blank slate. This 
> TC started 
> > > > > with well-defined contributed specs as well as interop
> > scenarios.
> > > > > I think this effort is beyond the need for use cases.
> > > > > 
> > > > > 4. >Paul: That would be the URI for the RDL document? 
> > (yes). The
> > > > > RDL document would point you at the schema file?
> > > > > 
> > > > > Change "RDL" to "RDDL" everywhere it occurs.
> > > > > 
> > > > > /paulc
> > > > > 
> > > > > Paul Cotton, Microsoft Canada
> > > > > 17 Eleanor Drive, Nepean, Ontario K2E 6A3
> > > > > Tel: (613) 225-5445 Fax: (425) 936-7329 
> > > > > mailto:pcotton@microsoft.com
> > > > > 
> > > > > 
> > > > > 
> > > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > > From: Gilbert Pilz [mailto:Gilbert.Pilz@bea.com]
> > > > > > Sent: August 18, 2005 8:40 PM
> > > > > > To: ws-rx@lists.oasis-open.org
> > > > > > Subject: [ws-rx] Draft teleconf minutes for 18 August 2005
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > Attached is the draft of the minutes. Please notify if you
> > > > > feel there
> > > > > is
> > > > > > anything missing or incorrect and I'll fix it before I
> > > > upload this
> > > > > > document (probably on Monday). I'm sorry for the parts that
> > > > > simply say
> > > > > > (back and forth) but when everyone talks at once it is
> > > > very hard to
> > > > > > catch what is being said.
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > - g
> > > > > > 
> > > > > 
> > > > > 
> > > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
>