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Subject: Re: [wsbpel] Groups - MS-01.rtf uploaded


Bernd,

The need to define the WSDL binding to facilitate the external service
is I believe the simple and easy part of the binding - one with upto
four parameters, the other with upto five, all but two of which are
optional.

There's basically two modes that match the two use cases -
#1 - validation - requires upto 4 parameters to be passed -
   some content instance,  a URL pointing to validation rules,
   and context parameters,  and then the result diagnostic set
   returned.

#2 - assembly - requires upto 5 parameters but has several
       patterns ( i,i,i,o,o) (i,_,_,o,o), (i,i,_.o,_) and so on -
       where the parameters are:
       URL pointing to assembly rules, context parameters,
       content to be assembled, result diagnostics set returned,
       and transaction set returned.

On the BPEL side you then need to make sure the binding
details of the content, and diagnostic result set needs to be
specified.  Then whatever external service can conform
to that.

Right now however Issue 11 is telling us that BPEL has
not been able to resolve the "some content" piece of this
satisfactorially - although John's posting is beginning to
show that this may be closer to hand.   It probably
means we have another use case :

Simple content aggregation into single block suitable
for external interfacing.

If BPEL can do that in a simple and consistent way - then
we can define the binding to the external validation / assembly
service from there.

Thanks, DW.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Eckenfels. Bernd" <B.Eckenfels@seeburger.de>
To: <wsbpel@lists.oasis-open.org>
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 1:46 PM
Subject: RE: [wsbpel] Groups - MS-01.rtf uploaded


Hello,

even if we use the external services for assignment, we need to specify
WSDLs for a well established subset, which is powerful enough to solve most
discussed use cases. and to not be too complicated so all engine providers
can implement then.

Otherwise the interoperability of the engines, and therefore the portability
of the scripts is greatly reduced.

Thats why I prefer to enhance the build in data handling at least so far,
that it can handle splits and iterations for document assembly, which are
core tasks in business processes.

Mit freundlichen Grüßen
Bernd Eckenfels
Chief Architect
--
SEEBURGER AG - Edisonstr.1 , D-75015 Bretten, Germany
Fax: +49 (0)7252 96-2400 - Phone: +49 (0)7252 96-1256
mailto:b.eckenfels@seeburger.de - http://www.seeburger.de


-----Original Message-----
From: David RR Webber [mailto:david@drrw.info]
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 6:01 PM
To: Danny van der Rijn; wsbpel@lists.oasis-open.org
Subject: Re: [wsbpel] Groups - MS-01.rtf uploaded


Danny,

That was my gut thought when I saw the XPath too.

You hate to have one implementation of BPEL doing
one thing - and the rest another.

More reasons to draw a line in the sand - and
have an external service handling this.

That's why understanding the minimalistic
data assignment needs is important here - just
what is the minimum level of field assignment
function needed for BPEL itself to maintain
state across process steps?

I think that is what we are talking about here and
nailing down that use case - then you can check
off the BPEL assignment functions.

And then anything to do with transaction validation
and assembly can safely move to an external service.

Otherwise you have perpetual scope creep and
interoperability goes in the dumpster.

DW.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Danny van der Rijn" <dannyv@tibco.com>
To: <wsbpel@lists.oasis-open.org>
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 11:29 AM
Subject: Re: [wsbpel] Groups - MS-01.rtf uploaded


> your last example uses dynamic xpath expressions in a GetVariableData.  i
> thought we frown on that (if we haven't forbidden it in the spec yet)?
>
> danny
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: <jevdemon@microsoft.com>
> To: <wsbpel@lists.oasis-open.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 7:16 AM
> Subject: [wsbpel] Groups - MS-01.rtf uploaded
>
>
> > The document MS-01.rtf has been submitted by John Evdemon
> (jevdemon@microsoft.com) to the OASIS Web Services Business Process
> Execution Language TC document repository.
> >
> > Document Description:
> > BPEL Data Manipulation Options This is a Technical Use Case designed to
> illustrate various options for manipulating data with BPEL.  Technical Use
> Cases are designed to clarify the BPEL specification and do not
necessarily
> have workflows associated with them.
> >
> >
> >
> > The following options are illustrated: Variable initialization,
Assignment
> of string, numeric, boolean and date values, Assignment of variables by
> copying other variable's values, Sample XPath calculations, Working with
> array structures
> >
> >
> >
> > The sample BPEL markup appears in the Abstract BPEL section of the
> document.
> >
> > Download Document:
> >
>
http://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/wsbpel/download.php/6045/MS-01.rtf
> >
> > View Document Details:
> >
>
http://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/wsbpel/document.php?document_id=6045
> >
> >
> > PLEASE NOTE:  If the above links do not work for you, your email
> application
> > may be breaking the link into two pieces.  You may be able to copy and
> paste
> > the entire link address into the address field of your web browser.
> >
> >
> >
> > To unsubscribe from this mailing list (and be removed from the roster of
> the OASIS TC), go to
>
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> >
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>
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