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Subject: AW: [xacml] Issue #11 again


Hi Rich,
see comment inline.
best regards
jan


 
> -----UrsprŘngliche Nachricht-----
> Von: Erik Rissanen [mailto:erik@axiomatics.com]
> Gesendet: Donnerstag, 22. Oktober 2009 15:22
> An: XACML TC
> Betreff: [xacml] Issue #11 again
> 
> All,
> 
> Jan is correct that there is a potential performance problem with XPath
> vs regexp. As he has demonstrated, it doesn't have to do with the
> performance of a regexp implementation vs XPath implementation. It has
> to do with the manner in which the expressions are used.
> 
> With the xpath based approach this is what happens (at least in a na´ve
> implementation):
> 
> 1. The policy contains an xpath expression and uses an xpath matching
> function.
> 
> 2. The PDP receives the multiple request with an xpath and expands this
> into N resources.
> 
> 3. Each resource is evaluated against the policy. To do this the xpath
> matching function will evaluate two xpath expressions. The individual
> resource id, which will select a single node, and the xpath expression
> from the policy, which will typicall evaluate to multiple nodes, let's
> say there are R of them. It will then check if the individual node is in
> among the R nodes.
> 
> 
> With a regexp matching function this will happen (I use the term "xpath
> expression equivalent" here since it is still an open question which
> language we will use here):
> 
> 1. The policy contains an "xpath expresssion equivalent" and uses a
> regexp matching function
> 
> 2. The PDP receives the multiple request with an "xpath equivalent" and
> expands this into N resources.
> 
> 3. Each resource is evaluated against the policy. To do this the regpexp
> matching function will work directly on the expression of the individual
> resource id.
> 
> 
> Notice the difference in step three. In the second case there is no
> requirement that the actual R nodes are enumerated.
> 
> I don't know what would be possible to do in the first case. A na´ve
> implementation would evaluate the xpath from the policy into a result
> set of R nodes, and then check whether the individual resource-id node
> is among these nodes. That would require iterating over up to R nodes,
> and is likely less efficient than the regexp approach.
> 
> Now, maybe it would be possible to run the xpath evaluation "backwards"?
> That is, given a node in an XML tree, can we ask whether a given xpath
> expression would select that node, without having to evaluate the full
> set of nodes? I don't know. If it would be possible, then an
> implementation of the xpath approach can have similar performance as the
> regexp approach.

If I understand your idea right, it seems to me that this actually the idea
behind the reg-expr based approach. generate a name=xpath-expression for a
node and match this against reg-expr-literals in the rules.
If there is a difference it would be helpful if you could explain in more
detail.

> 
> I think we should investigate this. If it is not possible, I agree that
> some other approach should be available. In that case I think the most
> fruitful approach is a defined form of xpath expressions for the
> individual resources. I think we can work around the namespace issue
> since similar notation as to the Clarke notation can be provided with
> XPath predicates. Or one can use a notation like "*[2]/*[1]", etc, which
> also does not have any namespace issues.
> 
> I would prefer a strict xpath to an entirely new scheme. With an xpath
> based approach people can use either xpath or regexp functions in their
> policies, with the same underlaying "expansion" scheme for the multiple
> request.
> 
> Best regards,
> Erik
> 
> 
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