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Subject: RE: [xliff-comment] Re: [xliff] RE: [xliff-comment] Re: [xliff] csprd03 - remaining inline comment to resolve


Hi David, all,

 

Ø  In other words, valid syntax can give the wrong information for reasons they haven't foreseen and they should double check. That's all.

 

I’m more and more confused I’m afraid.

 

Maybe you can give a concrete example of how one can give/get the wrong information?

(And how do you know it’s wrong).

 

Would it be something like this? (From example 20):

 

<unit id="u1" its:annotatorsRef="mt-confidence|MTServices-XYZ">

<segment>

<source><mrk id="m1" type="its:generic" its:mtConfidence="0.8982">Some Machine

        Translated text.</mrk></source>

 

And the tool “MTServices-XYZ” would not really be the tool that MTed the source text?

 

I don’t see how that could happen, except if some tool does not its job conforming to the normal ITS constraints.

But we don’t want such warnings: There are a lot of cases where the syntax can be right but the info wrong.

 

Also, how can you “double check” such info?

And if you guess it is wrong, what can you do about it?

 

It’s like having a warning saying: “The state attribute may be syntactically correct but not have the intended value.” (Because a tool did not updated it properly).

Such warnings are not really helping in my opinion.

 

Or maybe I’m missing completely the meaning of that paragraph (which is quite possible).

 

Cheers,

-yves

 

 

 

 

From: David Filip [mailto:david.filip@adaptcentre.ie]
Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2017 2:32 AM
To: Yves <yves@opentag.com>
Cc: XLIFF Main List <xliff@lists.oasis-open.org>; xliff-comment@lists.oasis-open.org
Subject: [xliff-comment] Re: [xliff] RE: [xliff-comment] Re: [xliff] csprd03 - remaining inline comment to resolve

 

The reason why this is on exactly these three is that they must be in scope of a *relevant* annotatorsRef (some of them conditionally, but this is clear from the annotation description).

 

This warning makes the implementer aware that being in scope is enough for validity but might not be enough to give the intended annotatorsRef information, I think that's an important warning and is XLIFF specific. In other words, valid syntax can give the wrong information for reasons they haven't foreseen and they should double check. That's all..


Dr. David Filip

===========

OASIS XLIFF OMOS TC Chair

OASIS XLIFF TC Secretary, Editor, Liaison Officer

Spokes Research Fellow

ADAPT Centre

KDEG, Trinity College Dublin

Mobile: +420-777-218-122

 

 

On Wed, May 17, 2017 at 11:08 PM, Yves <yves@opentag.com> wrote:

Hi David, all,

 

There are actually 3 places where that warning exists: For mtConfidence, for taConfidence and for termConfidence.

 

The first problem I have is that I don’t understand it, or at least I’m not sure I understand it correctly. And since I’m not sure I understand it, I can’t provide you with a better wording J

The second issue is that--if I understand it correctly--it seems to say: “Your confidence attribute may be in the scope of an annotatorsRef with the proper a xyz data category tool reference, but that reference may have been put there by another tool and has nothing to do with your value.”

 

If this is the meaning of the warning, then I’m not sure I get it: A confidence provider is supposed to maintain the annotatorsRef for the confidence, so it should always make sure the confidence and the tool-reference info are set properly. Is this a warning for the case where a tool does not follow the ITS rules?

 

In my humble opinion: Either the reader understand how annotatorsRef works and doesn’t need the warning, or the reader does not and needs a lot more information and should read the ITS specification.

 

In other words: This is an ITS problem, we should leave ITS education to the ITS specification. I would recommend to keep things simple and just drop the 3 warnings.

 

Cheers,

-yves

 

From: David Filip [mailto:david.filip@adaptcentre.ie]
Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2017 11:10 AM
To: Yves Savourel <ysavourel@enlaso.com>; XLIFF Main List <xliff@lists.oasis-open.org>
Cc: xliff-comment@lists.oasis-open.org
Subject: [xliff-comment] Re: [xliff] csprd03 - remaining inline comment to resolve

 

Hi Yves,

 

would you please advise an improved wording for the warning?

 

Warning

This annotation can be syntactically in scope of a relevant its:annotatorsRef attribute, while it still fails to resolve with the intended value. This can happen if more then one terminology providers were used. 

 

It seems fine to me ;-)

 

Cheers and thanks

dF


Dr. David Filip

===========

OASIS XLIFF OMOS TC Chair

OASIS XLIFF TC Secretary, Editor, Liaison Officer

Spokes Research Fellow

ADAPT Centre

KDEG, Trinity College Dublin

 

 

On Tue, May 16, 2017 at 12:09 PM, David Filip <david.filip@adaptcentre.ie> wrote:

Hi Yves,

 

I created a csprd03 issue from this

 

The associated thread is

 

Cheers

dF

 


Dr. David Filip

===========

OASIS XLIFF OMOS TC Chair

OASIS XLIFF TC Secretary, Editor, Liaison Officer

Spokes Research Fellow

ADAPT Centre

KDEG, Trinity College Dublin

 

 

On Thu, May 11, 2017 at 4:17 PM, Yves Savourel <ysavourel@enlaso.com> wrote:

Hi all,

 

There is at least one remaining comment in the draft: In section “5.9.7.2.3 ITS Terminology Annotation” we have a warning with an inline comment: “COMMENT: HARD TO UNDERSTAND THE INTENTION OF THE WARNING, NEEDS REWRITING OR SHOULD BE DROPPED.”

 

I guess this need to be resolved before csprd04.

 

Cheers,

-yves

 

 

Yves Savourel
Localization Solutions Architect | ENLASO®
4888 Pearl East Circle | Suite 300E | Boulder | Colorado 80301
t:
303.945.3759 | f: 303.516.1701
An ISO 9001:2015 certified company

 

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