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Subject: Re: [xri] XriAsRelativeUri - Question of Bindings

Title: Re: [xri] XriAsRelativeUri - Question of Bindings

The fact is that a proxy can run at any hostname.  The question is should we define a pattern that would allow a pre-processor to tell that the uri is really an xri, i.e. a hxri.  We currently make that determination by the hostname starting with xri.*.  The w3c for good reason has said that is bad.  The second option is by specifing that anything that lives within a well defined namespace such as xri.net.  The third option, imo, is to allow proxies at any hostname.  There doesnot seem to be a lot of value in pre-proccessing generic html pages for uris that we think are really xris.


----- Original Message -----
From: Barnhill, William [USA] <barnhill_william@bah.com>
To: John Bradley <jbradley@mac.com>; Chasen, Les
Cc: Nika Jones <njones@ouno.com>; OASIS XRI TC <xri@lists.oasis-open.org>
Sent: Sun Nov 09 07:47:20 2008
Subject: RE: [xri] XriAsRelativeUri - Question of Bindings

Will saying that people wishing to run a proxy server can do so in one or both of two ways, either example.com.xri.net or xri.example.com? I realize that this may be imposing a possible restriction on the use of subdomains but since I think the vast majority of users will not care and will prefer the ease of just setting up a sub-domain off their own server.

Limiting the process to xri.net raises a question that I'd like to see answered in the spec if we're going to go with just the xri.net method: What happens when xri.net goes down?

The other thing is, I know you John and the rest of us that are the current XRI crowd, and have no problem with xri.net as a single point of management now, but what about in 5 years? 10?

What's to stop the next management of xri.net from deciding to charge all the people running proxy servers for the privilege?

That's a nasty question but I'd guarantee someone will ask it if we go with subdomains of xri.net as the only way to do a proxy server and have it be understood to be an HXRI by spec-compliant clients.

For the above reasons I think at a minimum we should support both the xri subdomain method and the subdomain of xri.net method, if we are going to support the second one at all.


-----Original Message-----
From: John Bradley [mailto:jbradley@mac.com]
Sent: Sat 11/8/2008 9:57 PM
To: Chasen, Les
Cc: Nika Jones; OASIS XRI TC
Subject: Re: [xri] XriAsRelativeUri - Question of Bindings

Yes a CNAME would work.  If we are talking about tens of organizations wanting to run proxy servers in the XRI sub-scheme space then it probably isn't a big deal.

Perhaps some automated form to add a CNAME for a given domain.  ie if I want to add an entry for xri.example.com it would add a cname for xri.example.com.xri.net pointing to xri.example.com.

Something that gets a A request for xri.example.com.cri.net and automaticly returns a CNAME for xri.example.com will have to be custom but I am certain that Peter can whip it up in a day or two hacking BIND.

What it needs to do is dead simple.


On 8-Nov-08, at 6:24 PM, Chasen, Les wrote:

        We could do it by configuration.  People telling us to add them.  That seems sub optimal.
        [Chasen, Les] I guess I am not very creative.  This is the only option I can think of.  The request would be for a cname I think.
        We could modify the Zone server to do some sort of proxy operation to return the A record directly.
        [Chasen, Les] Some sort of proxy operation . I am not aware of anything in DNS that does that for you in a standard fashion.  A special proxy server could be created but that would be . well . special.
        Or we could tell everyone to forget about using there own proxy in there HXRI and use xri.net for everything.
        I don't know that the how you get a name in *.xri.net needs to be a part of the spec.
        [Chasen, Les] Probably not.
        We will probably also define dome other mechanism to indicate a sub scheme that is not dependent on DNS.
        That method is also required for XRDS-Simple/XRD as I under stand it.
        On 7-Nov-08, at 10:10 AM, Chasen, Les wrote:

        How do the sub-delegations of xri.net get in the zone of xri.net?
        From: John Bradley [mailto:jbradley@mac.com]
        Sent: Friday, November 07, 2008 11:58 AM
        To: Nika Jones
        Cc: OASIS XRI TC
        Subject: Re: [xri] XriAsRelativeUri - Question of Bindings
        *.xri.net is just a way to determine by inspection that the http(s) URI adheres to the XRI subjcheme for http:
        It has to do with the chain of authority.  We proposed in 2.0 that we use xri.* as the pattern for proxy servers.
        The TAG said no you cant do that it violates AWWW in that we would be steeling a host name out of everyones namespace.
        The principle is that you can only define policy for hosts under your domain.
        So they have this as a principle but no mechanism to accomplish this.
        An idea that we had to accommodate there principle but still allow for people to have there own proxy servers is to set up the DNS for xri.net in such a way that if you request an A record for xri.boeing.com.xri.net it would return the A record for xri.boeing.com.  This lets boeing run there own proxy at xri.boeing.com and produce HXRI like https://xri.boeing.com.xri.net/@boeing*marty that use there own proxy server,  but are still XRI by inspection.
        They could get tricky and have two proxy servers one inside there firewall and one outside using dns split horizon.
        As the HXRI that they produce are resolvable as URI from there proxy but by inspection a partner like Lockheed could resolve them via its own resolver or at https://xri.net as it sees fit for the application.
        So to your question http://employees.example.com.xri.net/=nika.jones should resolve to the same meta data as http://parts.example.com.xri.net/=nika.jones  they are just separate proxies for load balancing and performance reasons.
        This is not requiring anyone to set up there own proxy.  However it makes it easier for people to do that if they require it.
        John Bradley
        On 7-Nov-08, at 1:03 AM, Nika Jones wrote:

        In section 6 - "Proposed HTTP and HTTPS Bindings"
        What exactly does *.xri.net do?
        If the "*" means I can put anything there, does that mean all of the resolution happens on the "*" server?
        Also if I designate a server (or group) with sub-domains to do resolution work... ie. employees.example.com and parts.example.com ... under the "same domain" proposal can I split that work up? And would it become something like  http://employees.example.com.xri.net/=nika.jones right?
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