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Subject: Re: [ebsoa] New Chair - John Hardin
That would be the list, thanks David. Joe, the ebMS v3 direction has been (and I think still is) to encompass the WS-I Basic Profile, the WS-Security and other WS* specs, thereby moving towards convergence. A curious point is that we don't see that kind of outreach yet from the other side.... john David Webber (XML) wrote: > Joe, > > That is exactly what we are qualifiying here in ebSOA!!! > > We have BPSS V2, ebMS V3, Registey V3 - but no updated > architecture that documents the new capabilities that all this > enables. > > Thanks, DW > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Chiusano Joseph" <chiusano_joseph@bah.com> > To: "john hardin" <john@sanghainteractive.com>; "Monica J. Martin" > <Monica.Martin@Sun.COM>; "David RR Webber" <david@drrw.info>; "Duane > Nickull" <dnickull@adobe.com>; <dmoberg@cyclonecommerce.com>; > <jturpin@cyclonecommerce.com>; <tony.scott@gm.com>; <john.l.jackson@gm.com>; > <psnack@aiag.org>; <ron.l.schuldt@lmco.com>; <ronschuldt@msn.com>; > <golsen@contivo.com>; "John Casillas" <johnc@mbproject.org>; > <mjyader@comcast.net>; <tdean@criticaltech.net>; > <ebsoa@lists.oasis-open.org>; "James Bryce Clark" > <jamie.clark@oasis-open.org> > Sent: Thursday, February 03, 2005 7:29 AM > Subject: RE: [ebsoa] New Chair - John Hardin > > > <Quote> > a) work towards interop between the WS and eb camps (ebXML v3 is closing > that gap rapidly - thanks Dale!) > </Quote> > > Can you please explain what "ebXML v3" is? > > Thanks, > Joe > > Joseph Chiusano > Booz Allen Hamilton > Strategy and Technology Consultants to the World > > > >>-----Original Message----- >>From: john hardin [mailto:john@sanghainteractive.com] >>Sent: Thursday, February 03, 2005 3:58 AM >>To: Monica J. Martin; David RR Webber; Duane Nickull; >>dmoberg@cyclonecommerce.com; jturpin@cyclonecommerce.com; >>tony.scott@gm.com; john.l.jackson@gm.com; psnack@aiag.org; >>ron.l.schuldt@lmco.com; ronschuldt@msn.com; >>golsen@contivo.com; John Casillas; mjyader@comcast.net; >>tdean@criticaltech.net; ebsoa@lists.oasis-open.org; James Bryce Clark >>Subject: Re: [ebsoa] New Chair - John Hardin >> >>Thanks Monica and thanks to all for the warm welcome. >> >>I have copied a number of folks on this, because I would like >>to enlist their assistance for the ebSOA editing activities >>or just for ideas as we move forward. Also Jamie and Dale >>asked me about addressing the ebXML-jc group. I had a good >>conversation with Jamie the other night, and got some >>direction from both him and from Duane. I would very much >>like to address the ebXML-jc, and get a braindump how the two >>groups need to dovetail. I'll plan on being on the call next >>Wed if allowed. >> >>My primary vision for the ebSOA group is to move forward with >>the work from the charter (pattern catalog) and act as a >>facilitator towards interoperability among the upcoming >>business process frameworks (WS*, ebXML and SemWeb are three >>that are working to gain dominance). The request-response >>model is a very simplistic view that isn't currently mapping >>well onto the true complexity that large industries have >>developed in their shared business processes. For example, no >>one will argue today that inventory visibility for the >>automotive industry is a request-response model between two >>partners. Healthcare is another area that is very complex, >>and requires multiple interactions between large numbers of >>process participants to complete the information exchange, >>with forks and decisions during the execution. >> >>The other reality is that process participants require >>constant realtime feeds of information from many points in >>the process, which are owned and offered by various companies >>of various sizes and IT capabilities. >>This spells out, to me at least, the need for a network >>operating framework, where processes run in an "app fabric" >>that is dependable and very open. Then we can layer event >>causation techniques and other things like shared industry >>process B.A.M. on top. The network REALLY IS the computer.... >> >>To accomplish this kind of integration, I believe that we need to: >> >>a) work towards interop between the WS and eb camps (ebXML v3 >>is closing that gap rapidly - thanks Dale!) >> >>b) gather and document, then publish and evangelize, real >>world use cases that prove SOA principles using ebXML and WS >>and shine a light on successful implementations >> >>c) include both WS* and ebXML patterns, along with SemWeb and >>agent patterns (no rocks thrown, please - the SemWeb/Agent >>stuff is the long-term target) >> >>d) work with WS-I and the specs to ensure that we have >>consistent direction towards convergence >> >>My belief is that the entire IT industry is poised on the >>verge of a major break in what I think is so far a >>stagnation. The potential of the internet is clear - and >>everyone is aware that it's potential is more than just human >>readable web pages. We all feel it, business has been >>preparing (somewhat) for it, and the engineers all want to build it. >> >>However, this level of information integration won't happen unless: >> >>a) the path to implementation of standards based messaging >>between partner, or producer/consumer, applications, is very clear >> >>b) all players involved in complex processes can participate >> >>c) the integration effort doesn't involve such a long, drawn >>out mapping effort everytime (this kills progress on the >>entire movement) >> >>The industry will continue to stall until we solve some of >>these problems. I would like to help by completing the >>patterns and the catalog of patterns, and publish the use >>cases to describe it. There also needs to be a major outreach >>effort to all industry groups that are building shared >>business processes (which by the way, look much more complex >>than simple request-response models). >> >>That's it, I guess.... >> >>John >>313.930.5323 >> >>Monica J. Martin wrote: >> >>>John, >>>On a related point (to ebSOA that is), previously Matt >> >>MacKenzie was >> >>>the ebSOA representative to the ebXML-jc. Perhaps you >> >>could provide >> >>>some insight into your overall vision of the ebSOA TC based on its >>>original charter. I've asked Jamie Clark to give an update on ebSOA >>>and SOA TC efforts. In the past, it was anticipated that >> >>ebSOA would >> >>>assist in defining the next generation architecture for ebXML. Your >>>thoughts would be greatly appreciated. Thanks. >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >>-- >>~~~~~~~~~ >>john c hardin >>sanghainteractive.com >>313.930.5323 cell >>mailto:john@sanghainteractive.com >> >>"The new electronic interdependence recreates the world in >>the image of a global village." >> >> Marshall McLuhan, "Gutenberg Galaxy", 1962 >> >> >> > > > > > > > -- ~~~~~~~~~ john c hardin sanghainteractive.com 313.930.5323 cell mailto:john@sanghainteractive.com "The new electronic interdependence recreates the world in the image of a global village." Marshall McLuhan, "Gutenberg Galaxy", 1962
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