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Subject: RE: [xdi] Proposed additional X3 representation format, or a replacement for X3 Whitespace



Interesting on validation. Yes, I was under impression that the pattern
A
   B
       /  
          C
             D

A/B/(A/B/$)
(A/B/$)/C/D

If that's not the case then yes, should be the following (or the following using $$ instead of $, to revisit an old topic :)

=markus
    +friend
        /
            $
                $is
                    =Bill.Barnhill
                +name
                    "Bill"


node.js is a server-side javascript platform.

Kind regards,

Bill Barnhill
Booz Allen Hamilton - Rome, NY
315-330-7386  | william.barnhill.ctr@rl.af.mil | barnhill_william@bah.com
________________________________________
From: markus.sabadello@gmail.com [markus.sabadello@gmail.com] On Behalf Of Markus Sabadello [markus.sabadello@xdi.org]
Sent: Saturday, January 02, 2010 3:14 AM
To: Barnhill, William [USA]
Cc: Nika Jones; Drummond Reed; OASIS - XDI TC
Subject: Re: [xdi] Proposed additional X3 representation format, or a   replacement for X3 Whitespace

Hmm this is getting off-topic, but your examples can't currently be parsed by my code, e.g. by the XDI Validator:
https://graceland.azigo.net/xdi-validator/XDIValidator

.. because in the inner graphs you start directly with predicates, references and literals, but you don't have subjects.

What subjects are the predicates $is and +name in your examples attached to? Is the subject implied or something?

Maybe it should look like this instead:

=markus
    +friend
        /
            $
                $is
                    =Bill.Barnhill
                +name
                    "Bill"

Another question, what is node.js ?

Markus

On Wed, Dec 30, 2009 at 4:32 PM, Barnhill, William [USA] <barnhill_william@bah.com<mailto:barnhill_william@bah.com>> wrote:
No time to go into in depth right now, but I've been using implied contexts rather than _context (based on feedback from you and Drummond on _context not being reserved), so
 {"=markus": {"+friend": {"=Bill.barnhill": {"+name":  "Bill"} } } }
would be something like the following in X3 Simple
=markus
    +friend
           /
               $is
                   =Bill.Barnhill
               +name
                    "Bill"

Prob. important for me to make clear that that XRI =Bill.Barnhill/+name/(data:text/plain,Bill) is being asserted by =markus about =Bill.Barnhill. RDF/OWL does not have an equivalent concept because they don't cover data authority so owl:sameAs is closest, but is different concept than $is. Maybe we need $about? This would be a $ word that states the graph contains statements about the given subject that are made by a different data authority than the one that is authoritative for the described subject.

Then again the following doesn't scan well at first blush to me:
=markus
    +friend
           /
               $about
                   =Bill.Barnhill
               +name
                    "Bill"


Kind regards,

Bill Barnhill
Booz Allen Hamilton - Rome, NY
315-330-7386  | william.barnhill.ctr@rl.af.mil<mailto:william.barnhill.ctr@rl.af.mil> | barnhill_william@bah.com<mailto:barnhill_william@bah.com>
________________________________________
From: markus.sabadello@gmail.com<mailto:markus.sabadello@gmail.com> [markus.sabadello@gmail.com<mailto:markus.sabadello@gmail.com>] On Behalf Of Markus Sabadello [markus.sabadello@xdi.org<mailto:markus.sabadello@xdi.org>]
Sent: Wednesday, December 30, 2009 9:00 AM
To: Barnhill, William [USA]
Cc: Nika Jones; Drummond Reed; OASIS - XDI TC
Subject: Re: [xdi] Proposed additional X3 representation format, or a   replacement for X3 Whitespace

Hmmm what would your last example (XRI with statements) look like in X3 Simple?

Markus

On Wed, Dec 30, 2009 at 1:20 PM, Barnhill, William [USA] <barnhill_william@bah.com<mailto:barnhill_william@bah.com><mailto:barnhill_william@bah.com<mailto:barnhill_william@bah.com>>> wrote:
Hi Nika,

It's a good idea but I'd be hesitant because escaping means we wouldn't be using just JSON. Instead we'd be using JSON + special string escaping. The  {"=markus": {"+friend": {"=Bill.barnhill": {} } } } form is much more verbose than string escaping but I think is better because it's pure JSON and for me is more intuitive. Looking at the above I'd see these variations

Literal String:  {"=markus": {"+friend+iname": "=Bill.Barnhill" }  }
Literal JSON:  {"=markus": {"+friend+gadgetSpec": {object, ...} }  }   (this is iffy as it'd be a special case just like string escaping would be - needs more thought)
Literal number:  {"=markus": {"+friend$size": 500 }  }
Literal boolean:  {"=markus": {"+friend$empty": false }  }
XRI with no statements:  {"=markus": {"+friend": {"=Bill.barnhill": {} } } }
XRI with statements:  {"=markus": {"+friend": {"=Bill.barnhill": {"+name":  "Bill"} } } }

The above comes from current work I am doing creating XRI tools using node.js, which I hope to have on Github as soon as my day job rush is over (Jan 15).

Kind regards,

Bill Barnhill
Booz Allen Hamilton - Rome, NY
315-330-7386  | william.barnhill.ctr@rl.af.mil<mailto:william.barnhill.ctr@rl.af.mil><mailto:william.barnhill.ctr@rl.af.mil<mailto:william.barnhill.ctr@rl.af.mil>> | barnhill_william@bah.com<mailto:barnhill_william@bah.com><mailto:barnhill_william@bah.com<mailto:barnhill_william@bah.com>>
________________________________________
From: Nika Jones [njones@ouno.com<mailto:njones@ouno.com><mailto:njones@ouno.com<mailto:njones@ouno.com>>]
Sent: Wednesday, December 30, 2009 2:40 AM
To: Barnhill, William [USA]
Cc: Drummond Reed; Markus Sabadello; OASIS - XDI TC
Subject: RE: [xdi] Proposed additional X3 representation format,  or a  replacement for X3 Whitespace

I'm pretty new to the XDI stuff (but I do want to get more involved)
...Could the X3J escape a string like the X3Whitespace?

So Cross References would look like:

{
   "=markus":
   {
       "+friend":    "\"=bill.barnhill\""
   }
}

or even:

{
   "=markus":
   {
       "+friend":    "'=bill.barnhill'"
   }
}

as the quote surrounding the text doesn't matter in JSON?

Nika

> Both good questions, I'll address them both in full  soon as possible but
> that won't be for a couple days as I'm really under the gun right now.
> Markus, the short answer to your question for was that I was using 'x' to
> mean ref, and "x" to mean string, but that's a language specific artifact.
> My initial thought is that
> {"+friend": "=Bill.Barnhill"} means value is a String (which could be an
> XRI if it validates as one), and
> {"+friend": {"=Bill.Barnhill": undefined}}
>
> Seems closest to my initial thinking but alas does not work in
> JSON.stringify, so perhaps
> {"+friend": {"=Bill.Barnhill": nulll}}
> or
> {"=markus": {"+friend": {"=Bill.barnhill": {} } } } <-- Despite lispish
> feel I probably like this one best of the ones that work.
>
>
> Kind regards,
>
> Bill Barnhill
> Booz Allen Hamilton - Rome, NY
> 315-330-7386  | william.barnhill.ctr@rl.af.mil<mailto:william.barnhill.ctr@rl.af.mil><mailto:william.barnhill.ctr@rl.af.mil<mailto:william.barnhill.ctr@rl.af.mil>> | barnhill_william@bah.com<mailto:barnhill_william@bah.com><mailto:barnhill_william@bah.com<mailto:barnhill_william@bah.com>>
> ________________________________________
> From: drummond.reed@gmail.com<mailto:drummond.reed@gmail.com><mailto:drummond.reed@gmail.com<mailto:drummond.reed@gmail.com>> [drummond.reed@gmail.com<mailto:drummond.reed@gmail.com><mailto:drummond.reed@gmail.com<mailto:drummond.reed@gmail.com>>] On Behalf Of
> Drummond Reed [drummond.reed@xdi.org<mailto:drummond.reed@xdi.org><mailto:drummond.reed@xdi.org<mailto:drummond.reed@xdi.org>>]
> Sent: Monday, December 28, 2009 5:39 PM
> To: Markus Sabadello
> Cc: Barnhill, William [USA]; OASIS - XDI TC
> Subject: Re: [xdi] Proposed additional X3 representation format, or a
> replacement for X3 Whitespace
>
> Good question, Markus. I was looking over Bill's example and had a second
> question. The example shows that subcontexts begin with the string
> "_context". That, too, is a valid XRI string. I think it would be a
> mistake to start reserving XRIs to have special semantics unless they are
> $ words defined for this purpose.
>
> So that's a second issue we need to address if we are going to make X3J
> part of the XDI Serialization spec.
>
> =Drummond
>
> On Mon, Dec 28, 2009 at 8:20 AM, Markus Sabadello
> <markus.sabadello@xdi.org<mailto:markus.sabadello@xdi.org><mailto:markus.sabadello@xdi.org<mailto:markus.sabadello@xdi.org>><mailto:markus.sabadello@xdi.org<mailto:markus.sabadello@xdi.org><mailto:markus.sabadello@xdi.org<mailto:markus.sabadello@xdi.org>>>> wrote:
> Hi Bill,
>
> I tried implementing your X3J format, but I have a question:
> How would one distinguish between a literal and a reference?
>
> E.g. if I have this X3J data:
>
> {
>     "=markus":
>         {
>             "+friend":    "=bill.barnhill"
>         }
> }
>
> How would I know if it translates to this graph:
>
> =markus
>         +friend
>                 =bill.barnhill
>
> or to this graph:
>
> =markus
>         +friend
>                 "=bill.barnhill"
>
> ??
>
> Markus
>
> On Fri, Jul 3, 2009 at 12:27 AM, Barnhill, William [USA]
> <barnhill_william@bah.com<mailto:barnhill_william@bah.com><mailto:barnhill_william@bah.com<mailto:barnhill_william@bah.com>><mailto:barnhill_william@bah.com<mailto:barnhill_william@bah.com><mailto:barnhill_william@bah.com<mailto:barnhill_william@bah.com>>>> wrote:
>
> I've edited http://wiki.oasis-open.org/xdi/X3Format to add text proposing
> an X3 representation that is directly in JSON as opposed to similar to
> JSON.  Given the broad adoption of JSON and the usefulness of this I'm
> seeing in my work I wanted to share it with the TC.  JSON format is still
> rough but works. I will add formatting rules section this weekend.
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>
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