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Subject: AW: [dita] Groups - DITA Proposed Feature #12021: Nesting sections (12021.html) uploaded

Yes indeed we had that case last year at Novartis, mainly regarding taking over legacy data.
The main point that Novartis mentioned in that discussion was:
1st they decided that each topic relates to one file in the database,
2nd if they are going to split content of one topic in several topics, most of their content will loose the context. So content that belongs literally together would be split appart into separate files. This splitting would not only make the content highly difficult to manage, those topics would no longer be meaningful when they stand alone.
Novartis has not yet decided if they go for DITA, Docbook or if they develop their own schema.
From my last discussions I heared that they will go for DITA and call it DITA+ by bending or breaking our rules. As already mentioned, how Novartis will proceed is not yet decided, they are waiting to hear what the DITA TC decides.
I would like to ask that question to the specialists of topic based authoring. What has more weight:
- a topic is a unit of information that is meaningfull when it stands alone
- a section in a topic is not alowed to contain sections
Chris Kravogel
SeicoDyne GmbH
Eichenstrasse 16
CH-6015 Reussbühl
Tel: +41 41 534 66 97
Mob: +41 78 790 66 97
Skype: seicodyne
Member of the DITA Technical Committee
Chairman of the DITA Machine Industry Subcommittee

Von: Michael Priestley [mailto:mpriestl@ca.ibm.com]
Gesendet: Dienstag, 30. Oktober 2007 14:34
An: Grosso, Paul
Cc: dita@lists.oasis-open.org
Betreff: RE: [dita] Groups - DITA Proposed Feature #12021: Nesting sections (12021.html) uploaded

My recollection is that it was primarily for use in creating regular groupings of sections or of content under sections for specialization purposes. This was the use case for Novartis that Chris brought forward, and also the use case from Paul Prescod who co-designed the original proposal.

For example, with these extra levels, you can model something like:

<problem> (from section)
<userresponse> (from bodydiv)
        <analysis> (from section)

There were some more complex use cases modeled in the original note series with Paul Prescod I believe.

I think where people need to model freely titled nested divisions, the answer continues to be nesting topics rather than nesting sections - to try to prevent the bloating of topics into whole chapters or books of content (losing the constraints on topic size/complexity that are among the distinctions between DITA and DocBook). But where additional levels of organization are needed within a topic that do not represent new ideas or topics (and thus do not require new unique headings), I think this proposal gives the specializer considerably more freedom - as well as providing a general mechanism for grouping sections or blocks for the sake of conreffing a mixed range or for simplified conditional processing/metadata.

Michael Priestley
Lead IBM DITA Architect

"Grosso, Paul" <pgrosso@ptc.com>

10/30/2007 09:12 AM

RE: [dita] Groups - DITA Proposed Feature #12021:  Nesting sections (12021.html)   uploaded

I was a little surprised to see this suggesting a bodydiv/sectiondiv
element but still not allowing sections to nest, which is what I
thought was meant by nesting sections.

I thought one of the drivers of this requirement was to be able
to model DocBook's nested sections more easily, but with the
suggested model, this would be even harder.

What are the benefits of this suggested model over simply allowing
section to contain section?


> -----Original Message-----
> From: jim.earley@flatironssolutions.com
> [mailto:jim.earley@flatironssolutions.com]
> Sent: Tuesday, 2007 October 30 7:15
> To: dita@lists.oasis-open.org
> Subject: [dita] Groups - DITA Proposed Feature #12021:
> Nesting sections (12021.html) uploaded
> This is the HTML version of proposal 12021
>  -- Mr. Jim Earley
> The document named DITA Proposed Feature #12021:  Nesting sections
> (12021.html) has been submitted by Mr. Jim Earley to the OASIS Darwin
> Information Typing Architecture (DITA) TC document repository.
> Document Description:
> View Document Details:
> http://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/dita/document.php
> ?document_id=25904
> Download Document:  
> http://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/dita/download.php
> /25904/12021.html

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