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Subject: Groups - DITA TC Meeting Minutes 11 October 2022 uploaded
- From: Nancy Harrison<nharrison@infobridge-solutions.com>
- To: <dita@lists.oasis-open.org>
- Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2022 18:33:24 +0000 (UTC)
Submitter's message
ActionItems: none
=================================================
Minutes of the OASIS DITA TC
Tuesday, 11 October 2022
Recorded by Hancy Harrison
link to agenda for this meeting:
https://wiki.OASIS-open.org/dita/PreviousAgendas
Attendance:
===========
Bill Burns, Kris Eberlein, Nancy Harrison, Scott Hudson, Eliot Kimber, Zoe Lawson, Keith Schengili-Roberts, Eric Sirois, Dawn Stevens, Frank Wegmann, Jim Tivy, Todd Thorne
Business
========
1. Roll call
Regrets: Gershon Joseph, Robert Anderson, Stan Doherty
2. Approve minutes from previous business meeting:
04 October 2022
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202210/msg00009.html (Harrison, 06 October 2022)
Kris moved, 2nd Scott, approved by TC
3. Announcements - none
4. Action items
04 October 2022
Kris and Eliot: Review e-mails listed under generalization, suggest direction spec should take
[Kris and Eliot will both try to get to this during the next week.]
5. Volunteer tasks
Eliot: Update image for "Overview of document-type shells" topic
- Eliot; couln't get to this
Dawn and Comtech: Develop draft of changes from DITA 1.3 to DITA 2.0 (due 18 October 2022)
- Dawn; hoping to work on this next week.
6. Review of DITA 2.0 proposal deadlines
https://wiki.oasis-open.org/dita/DeadlinesDITA2.0
Combined stage two and three
(Kimber) Change @poster to (https://github.com/oasis-tcs/dita/issues/753)
Kris; Eliot sent out his proposal on 10/10; I've returned my comments, Scott?
- Scott; hopefully by end of next week.
Stage three
(Anderson) New impose-role attribute (https://github.com/oasis-tcs/dita/issues/670)
30 September 2022: Submit to reviewers (Joseph, Wegmann)
- Kris; Robert was not able to do this; we don't know whether he'll be able to get to it this week.
(Kimber) Clean-up changes (https://github.com/oasis-tcs/dita/issues/397)
- Eliot; I did poster proposal instead...
- Kris; when might we be able to see this?
- Eliot; I'll try to get it done this weekend.
7. DITA 2.0 spec review: Appendixes (28 September - 10 October 2022
Opening of review
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202209/msg00042.html (Eberlein, 28 September 2022)
Topics that need review
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202210/msg00003.html (04 October 2022)
Status:
Comments about "Element-by element recommendations"
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202210/msg00014.html (Eberlein, 11 October 2022)
- Kris; thanks to Dawn and Eliot for many thoughtful comments on element-by element recommendations. As background, this topic was created for 1.1, in conjunction with Translation SC; since 1.1, it got updated as we added new elements and domains. For 2.0, we've split off base from tech content, so old legacy content got added, but it hasn't been reviewed since 1.1. Dawn and Eliot added a lot of very constructive comments, especially wrt some tables that have confusing/unclear headings. I never really understood what the headers' meaning were. and there was gen'l confusion, e.g., subflow wasn't clearly explained; also footnotes that wereen't rendered appropriately in PDF.
- Kris; Nancy & Bill, your time will be better spent reviewing an updated version. 2 PDFs attachedl 2nd is updated version of topic
- Todd; why are we mentioning this is a container anyway? It will just be a marker in translation memory.
- Kris; folks who were involved in creating translation memory wanted to know if there were translatable elements down the tree that were also translatable.
- Eric; also, fuzzy matches may be important.
- Eliot; we also wondered why we're mentioning non-translatable elements. is it for the use of developers of translation memory software?
- Kris; a lot of this was about configuring translation workbench software. this only applies to OOTB OASIS elements. If you have other elements, your mileage may vary.. I wondered why we have info about block and inline rendering, and why does it matters?
- Eliot; b/c it's a clue to whether an element is a single unit of a translation map, but not inherently.
- Kris; I didn't take it out of prototype b/c it was a first pass, I just wanted to focus on changes we all agreed on. Should we talk about everything; block, inline, subflow? We probably don't want to go there.
- Eliot; if it's metadata, then it's not rendered, so presentation isn't relevant for metadata.
- Kris; I asked Robert about this, i.e., 'why do we have block metadata for authoring?' He said, sometimes the metadata is rendered.
- Eliot; but that's entirely a facet of rendering style.
- Kris; and so the value for audience element should just say metadata, not block metadata...
- Kris; we want to address the question of what a subflow is. On page 1, notes, the third list item attempst to explain that, but I'm not sure I'm using subflow elements the way they'd be used in translation workbenches. These elements would not be translated.
- Eliot; so is subflow a term of art in L10N, or is it just made up?
- Kris; I can't answer that. It's a shame Gershon isn't here
- Eliot; I would call them 'out-of-line' elements.
- Kris; I'm not sure; I can describe how I reworked it; I also added some draft-comments about standardizing columns., also included some of Eliot's comments. e.g. for map elements, wrt the idea of having translation/presentation.
- Eliot; right, a map is inherently metadata, so the distinction didn't seem releavant.
- Kris; I'd like to get more info about why folks who put this table together thought it was important to have the block/inline column. if folks have any general questions?
[none]
- Nancy; we need to have Gershon here going forward with this.
- Kris; I agree. And another point; image and hazard zymbol. And how is othernote translatable? Since it would be used as keyword (see Eliot's comment on this in review). I would think that if implementations are using othertype, they're also translating it. that's what I've seen.
- Eliot; point is well taken. because I would never do that, it seems like the wrong thing to do. And wrt procesing that's done for node and spectitle, I'd expect to look up that value to find a locale-specific string for that language
- Kris; but othertype has always been the exception for that.
- Dawn; glad Eliot brought this up; I thought of it but talked myself out of it. My advice to clients is that it shouldn't be translatable, but it doesn't always work.
- Eric; you have to go to a lot of trouble, because Trados strips those out; you have to go to a lot of trouble to translate those
- Kris; for 2.0, there's no longer an @othertype on note/hazardstatement, so hazardstatement only takes values that match ANSI specs.
8. DITA 1.x to 2.0 migration work
Update about the committee note?
Kris; Eliot, have you checked in your work on this?
Eliot; it's on a branch, but I haven't created a pull request for it.
- Kris; the files still have file names with underscores...
- Eliot; I wasn't able to get to that; will try for this weekend
- Kris; I'll send you a reminder.
9. Generalization
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202209/msg00002.html (Joseph, 04 September 2022)
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202209/msg00008.html (Eberlein, 06 September 2022)
Where we mention generalization in the DITA 2.0 spec
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202209/msg00010.html (Eberlein, 06 September 2022)
[hold for next week]
10. Schedule for upcoming DITA 2.0 spec reviews:
Content reviewed AND content still to be reviewed
Open review items
- Kris; don't think we'll have another review this week. I think folks may be getting sick of reviewing, and I need to step back from doing more editorial work for a while. Another psosibility would be it would ideal consider techcontent material.
- Nancy; how would that help?
- Kris; some techcontent material could could go out before other base content.
- Scott; not getting sick of it, but it's a real time crunch with my day job.
- Kris; and we can't publish 2.0 without having content sufficiently reviewed. So the only way to do it is to carve out time for it. And are there other people we could get involved? And some editorial work might be able to be shared on techcontent pieces.
12 noon ET close
-- Ms. Nancy Harrison
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