RE: [docbook-tc] request for conref

["Rowland, Larry" <larry.rowland@hp.com>]

I think the conref would support lower-level reuse as opposed to
document assembly, replacing xinclude (at least as I read the 
request).  One question is how far are we expected to take the 
conref model.  As a simple place holder for indicating the 
structural correctness of the intended replacement (I am
putting a note here, so I am using a note to represent it) I
think there is value in this idea over xinclude, which is a 
generic representation with no way of representing the intent
of the author (it means "put something here" with no connection
to what the author intends to put there).  The differing levels
of implementation of the referencing mechanism also makes it
tricky to predict whether an xinclude will work without knowing
in advance the tool chain used to process it.  However,
specifying the constraints that DITA appears to about making 
sure the included content maps to the element with the conref
seems extreme and beyond what I would want to attempt to do.
Providing it as a mechanism for expressing the authors intent
I consider valuable.

I think waiting for the xinclude standard to mature fails to
address the current problem that the person requesting this
feature is trying to address, which is a near term need.

As long as we are careful in adding the conref (or whatever
it ends up being called) so that there is no ambiguity, I 
would favor this.  Just make sure the presence of the new
attribute requires that the element it is added to be empty.  
We may want to add an attribute that is only permitted when a
conref is present that would allow the user to specify that
ids on the included content be suppressed (very useful for
reusing content within a document).  An id on the element
with the conref should replace the id on a referenced 
element (also helpful for reusing content within a document).

Larry Rowland

-----Original Message-----
From: Scott Hudson [mailto:scott.hudson@flatironssolutions.com] 
Sent: Wednesday, July 15, 2009 8:25 AM
To: Gershon Joseph (gerjosep)
Cc: Bob Stayton; DocBook Technical Committee
Subject: Re: [docbook-tc] request for conref

I would also be resistant to conrefs. I think some of this functionality 
is already included in the new assembly proposal anyways.

Thanks and best regards,

--Scott

Scott Hudson	
Senior XML Architect

+1 (303) 542-2146  |  Office
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Gershon Joseph (gerjosep) wrote:
> Personally I'd vote against conrefs and instead wait for XInclude and
> XPointer to mature. The W3C removed conrefs from XML because processing
> them was deemed complex. IBM already had conref processing in their SGML
> tools and therefore brought conref back in when they invented DITA.
> Conrefs have limitations, which leads to almost as much headache in
> terms of maintenance as file entities generate. So now DITA 1.2 will be
> introducing key referencing and content key referencing. This latter
> approach offers amazing flexibility for reuse and is very lean on
> maintenance overhead. I'd be willing to discuss this during the meeting
> today if the TC is interested.
>
> Gershon
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Bob Stayton [mailto:bobs@sagehill.net] 
> Sent: Wednesday, July 15, 2009 12:34 AM
> To: DocBook Technical Committee
> Subject: [docbook-tc] request for conref
>
> We had a late addition to the DocBook RFEs yesterday, and it is related
> to the modular doc discussion we will be having on Wednesday, so I
> thought I would call your attention to it.  The request is for a conref
> mechanism in DocBook.  See the RFE at:
>
> http://sourceforge.net/tracker/?func=detail&aid=2820947&group_id=21935&a
> tid=384107
>
> Bob Stayton
> Sagehill Enterprises
> bobs@sagehill.net
>
>
>
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