RE: [legalxml-courtfiling] EFiling Process Models Subcommittee

[Allen Jensen <ajensen@occourts.org>]

We're using SOAP/MSMQ/COM+ for transmission and reliability from the
EFSP server at the EFP to our EFM servers only.  Then it would be a
local communication from the EFM to the CMS/DMS systems.  


Allen Jensen
Orange County Superior Court
Internet Development / EFiling
949.472.6946



>>> <Tom.Clarke@courts.wa.gov> 12/27/02 08:29AM >>>
John,

I can't resist responding as a member of Legal XML, rather than OXCI. 
Are
you suggesting that we use SOAP to transact directly from the EFSP to
the
CMS without using an EFM at all to mediate the transactions?  If so,
that is
certainly a major departure from the architectural concepts that Legal
XML
has followed in the past (or at least my understanding of them).  Just
checking, since I am certainly open to consideration of all
possibilities.

I believe OXCI would like to mirror as closely as possible the
proposed
Legal XML architecture for Version 2.0 (Blue) of the standards, when
it
exists, without making any more architectural decisions than would be
appropriate for an implementer of standards (rather than a setter of
them).
I would love to see the business process subcommittee of Legal XML get
out
ahead of the OXCI project, since the required business models drive
implementation decisions almost as much as they drive standards
requirements.  To the extent that implementers get out ahead of the
standards, commercial vendors will be in a much better position to
evolve
their EFM offerings (to remain in compliance) as the Legal XML
standards
mature.

-----Original Message-----
From: John Messing [mailto:jmessing@law-on-line.com] 
Sent: Friday, December 27, 2002 8:13 AM
To: Donald.Bergeron@lexisnexis.com; drdaniels@bearingpoint.net;
legalxml-courtfiling@lists.oasis-open.org; Tom.Clarke@courts.wa.gov 
Subject: RE: [legalxml-courtfiling] EFiling Process Models
Subcommittee

Then in the same spirit I would like to pose a question to the
consortium
whether OXCI can do anything more or better than XSLT and ordinary web
services such asp.net together. If not, and the latter are
standardarized
and freely available, why not consider using them instead?

---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: Tom.Clarke@courts.wa.gov 
Date:  Fri, 27 Dec 2002 08:02:21 -0800

>Well, I hesitate to speak for the OXCI consortium when some of these
>architectural decisions have not been finalized by either the OXCI
>Consortium or Legal XML.  OXCI is intended to be an EFM reference
>implementation.  As such, it does need API's for interacting with an
EFSP,
>Court Policy, Court CDC, a CMS and a DMS.
>
>It also assumes the existence of a CMS/DMS-unique Adapter that stands
>between the EFM and the CMS/DMS.  The Adapter handles some of the
>translation duties, since the OXCI group suspects that to do
otherwise
would
>put an unrealistic burden on the EFM, Court Policy and Court CDC. 
Some
>vendors suggested that might be the case during discussion of the
last
Court
>Policy version.
>
>I would like to refer any additional questions about OXCI to Greg
Arnold,
>who leads the OXCI Consortium. 
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: John Messing [mailto:jmessing@comcast.net] 
>Sent: Thursday, December 26, 2002 5:40 PM
>To: Tom.Clarke@courts.wa.gov; Bergeron, Donald L. (LNG); John
Messing;
>Daniels, Dwight (BearingPoint);
legalxml-courtfiling@lists.oasis-open.org 
>Subject: Re: [legalxml-courtfiling] EFiling Process Models
Subcommittee
>
>I understood that OXCI was a way of parsing the xml and sending it to
the
>CMS-API for translation into methods and properties that the legacy
CMS
>systems could use. Are you saying that OXCI does otherwise?
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: <Tom.Clarke@courts.wa.gov>
>To: <Donald.Bergeron@lexisnexis.com>; <jmessing@law-on-line.com>;
><drdaniels@bearingpoint.net>;
<legalxml-courtfiling@lists.oasis-open.org>
>Sent: Monday, December 23, 2002 10:48 AM
>Subject: RE: [legalxml-courtfiling] EFiling Process Models
Subcommittee
>
>
>> I just want to respond to John's comment about OXCI.  OXCI is
looking
>> closely at using a web services approach to all API's and reusing
>> appropriate parts of Version 3.0 of the Justice XML Data Dictionary
>schema.
>> In any case, it is likely that schema will be used instead of DTD's
and
>the
>> standard web services messaging protocol (either SOAP 1.2 or ebXML
>Messaging
>> 2.0) will be used.  The California 2GEFS project is the one not
planning
>to
>> use web services.
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Bergeron, Donald L. (LNG-DAY)
>[mailto:Donald.Bergeron@lexisnexis.com] 
>> Sent: Monday, December 23, 2002 6:35 AM
>> To: 'John Messing'; Bergeron, Donald L. (LNG-DAY); 'Daniels, Dwight
>> (BearingPoint)'; CourtFiling List (E-mail)
>> Subject: RE: [legalxml-courtfiling] EFiling Process Models
Subcommittee
>>
>> These are possible effects of effort described. This will occur when
we
>look
>> at the functions supported by these technologies and how they apply
to a
>> better defined set of Models required by the community.
>>
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Don
>>
>> Donald L. Bergeron
>> Data & Systems Architect
>> donald.bergeron@lexisnexis.com 
>>
>> 937-865-1276 O
>> 937-748-2775 H
>> 937-672-7781 M
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: John Messing [mailto:jmessing@comcast.net] 
>> Sent: Monday, December 23, 2002 9:01 AM
>> To: Bergeron, Donald L. (LNG-DAY); 'Daniels, Dwight
(BearingPoint)';
>> CourtFiling List (E-mail); EFiling Process List (E-mail)
>> Cc: Bergeron, Donald L. (LNG-DAY)
>> Subject: Re: [legalxml-courtfiling] EFiling Process Models
Subcommittee
>>
>>
>> I think we need to look at
>>
>> 1. web services as a replacement for CMS-API and OXCI, which are
now
>> outdated technologies in my opinion, and focus on exposing the
methods of
>> the case management systems to the web directly through XML web
services;
>> and
>>
>> 2. look to Schemas and RDF solutions being developed in parallel so
as to
>> stay abreast of the technological curve.
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Bergeron, Donald L. (LNG-DAY)"
<Donald.Bergeron@lexisnexis.com>
>> To: "'Daniels, Dwight (BearingPoint)'"
<drdaniels@bearingpoint.net>;
>> "CourtFiling List (E-mail)"
<legalxml-courtfiling@lists.oasis-open.org>;
>> "EFiling Process List (E-mail)"
>> <legalxml-courtfiling-processmodels@lists.oasis-open.org>
>> Cc: "Bergeron, Donald L. (LNG-DAY)"
<Donald.Bergeron@lexisnexis.com>
>> Sent: Monday, December 23, 2002 6:51 AM
>> Subject: RE: [legalxml-courtfiling] EFiling Process Models
Subcommittee
>>
>>
>> > I will join in this effort and urge the members of the community
to
>> actively
>> > participate. Purely technical nor purely court policies and
procedures
>> exist
>> > in a vacuum.  Business Policy(fee charging, fee payment...),
Security
>> > Policy(trusted partners, arms length...) and Related
Telecommunication
>> > Policy all have different Models from which the courts may choose.
We
>must
>> > as a community look at the interactions between these models and
their
>> > implications.
>> >
>> > Understanding these will prepare us for doing a sound set of
>requirements
>> > for Court Filing Blue and the specification that result.
>> >
>> >
>> > Regards,
>> >
>> > Don
>> >
>> > Donald L. Bergeron
>> > Data & Systems Architect
>> > donald.bergeron@lexisnexis.com 
>> >
>> > 937-865-1276 O
>> >
>> >
>> > -----Original Message-----
>> > From: Daniels, Dwight (BearingPoint)
[mailto:drdaniels@bearingpoint.net] 
>> > Sent: Friday, December 20, 2002 3:54 PM
>> > To: CourtFiling List (E-mail); EFiling Process List (E-mail)
>> > Subject: [legalxml-courtfiling] EFiling Process Models
Subcommittee
>> >
>> >
>> > As you have probably seen from John Greacen's summary of the Las
Vegas
>> > meeting, the CMS-API subcommittee has undergone a transformation.
It is
>> now
>> > the EFiling Process Models subcommittee. I am tasked with
composing the
>> > first draft of the statement of work for the subcommittee and
>> disseminating
>> > it prior to the January 6th conference call, but I wanted to take
this
>> > opportunity to give you an idea of what the committee's objectives
are
>and
>> > to encourge participation among those interested.
>> >
>> > In a nutshell, the committee felt that we needed to get a better
>> > understanding of the various conceptual process models for
electronic
>> filing
>> > that exist in the community, document those models and compare
them for
>> > commonalities and differences. Through this process we will be
seeking
>to
>> > identify the intersection points among the various models and to
>evaluate
>> > those points as candidates for APIs to be defined in subsequent
work.
>> >
>> > The focus of this work is not technical. It is process oriented.
As
>such,
>> > the input and assistance of non-technical practitioners is
crucial. The
>> more
>> > we get, the more likely we will be to succeed. I therefore
strongly
>> encourge
>> > those who have a vision for what the business process flow (or
flows)
of
>> > electronic filing should look like to join us in this effort.
>> >
>> > Dwight R. Daniels | Manager | BearingPoint | Costa Mesa, CA
>> > Office +1.714.957.4835 | Project +1.714.568.5697 | Mobile
>+1.805.990.9994
>> > www.bearingpoint.com 
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
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