RE: [soa-rm] What Is A "Metaservice"?

["Chiusano Joseph" <chiusano_joseph@bah.com>]

> I dismiss out-of-hand the ambiguous creation of jargon 

Actually, it was the transport of ambiguous jargon from an external
source to here:)

Joe

Joseph Chiusano
Associate
Booz Allen Hamilton
 
700 13th St. NW, Suite 1100
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> -----Original Message-----
> From: Ken Laskey [mailto:klaskey@mitre.org] 
> Sent: Monday, February 13, 2006 3:07 PM
> To: McGregor.Wesley@tbs-sct.gc.ca; cbashioum@mitre.org
> Cc: rexb@starbourne.com; soa-rm@lists.oasis-open.org
> Subject: RE: [soa-rm] What Is A "Metaservice"?
> 
> Wes,
> 
> My problem is we seem to have a term for which we are 
> searching for a meaning.  We do better in making concepts 
> clear (including concepts beyond the RM) and then figuring 
> out a descriptive name.  The term "metaservice" seems like 
> confusion just begging to happen, i.e. the name doesn't 
> provide an unambiguous description and our discussion points 
> out possibilities but also doesn't know which of the 
> possibilities is needed and why.
> 
> I dismiss out-of-hand the ambiguous creation of jargon, not 
> in developing understanding of (and naming) real problems.
> 
> Ken
> 
> At 02:45 PM 2/13/2006, McGregor.Wesley@tbs-sct.gc.ca wrote:
> >Ken,
> >
> > From a minimalist point of view your point is valid and the 
> RM as it 
> > now stands reflects that.
> >
> >For those who manage large multi-business, multi-jurisdiction, 
> >multi-departmental, multi-lingual enterprises, there may be 
> great value 
> >in having a "meta-service" in order to assist the classification of 
> >services and provide the level of abstraction needed to ease the 
> >building of a common framework.
> >
> >To out-of-hand dismiss the idea, is, to say the least, 
> self-defeating.
> >
> >Regards,
> >
> >Wes
> >
> >P.S. Be careful of what you call worthless,  what large SOA 
> players are 
> >backing this RM?
> >
> >
> >  -----Original Message-----
> >From:   Ken Laskey [mailto:klaskey@mitre.org]
> >Sent:   February 13, 2006 2:23 PM
> >To:     Bashioum, Christopher D
> >Cc:     McGregor, Wesley; Rex Brooks; soa-rm@lists.oasis-open.org
> >Subject:        Re: [soa-rm] What Is A "Metaservice"?
> >
> >  From an SOA standpoint, unless it is vital information that would 
> >somehow be made known through the service description, there 
> is only a 
> >service and we neither know nor care whether it is atomic or meta.
> >
> >re another comment, I see no reason to generate a worthless 
> definition 
> >just to beat someone else's worthless definition to the punch.
> >
> >Ken
> >
> >On Feb 13, 2006, at 11:00 AM, Bashioum, Christopher D wrote:
> >
> > > I just now read the actual blog, and I think Dave L. is right-on 
> > > with regard to the overall intent of better describing 
> services in a 
> > > consistent way.  In fact, I've been working on such a 
> > > meta-description for services for the DoD for a number of months 
> > > now.  My problem is with the term.  I made the following 
> post to his 
> > > blog
> > >
> > > <Post>
> > > Agree with the article, but not the term metaservice.  We 
> are using 
> > > the term "service definition framework" for the added information 
> > > used to describe the services.
> > >
> > > I would submit that most of this additional information 
> should exist 
> > > within the WSDL framework, most of it in the abstract 
> portion.  In 
> > > WSDL-2.0, it would generally be children of the Interface element.
> > >
> > > My problem with the term "metaservice" is that it sounds 
> more like a 
> > > type of service (like a stock quote service, or a weather 
> service).  
> > > It does not communicate what you are looking for.  A better term 
> > > might be meta-description, or a meta-interface, or something like 
> > > that </Post>
> > >
> > > That being said, Joe's original comment to the SOA-RM 
> list about a 
> > > metaservice being a "service about services" would also 
> have another 
> > > name, depending on what it did.  E.g., an aggregation service, an 
> > > orchestration service, etc.  To call it a metaservice 
> doesn't really 
> > > describe what it does.  On the other hand, any service that uses 
> > > other services may be a "type" or "class" of service that 
> uses other 
> > > services.  In which case a service that is itself an 
> aggregation of 
> > > other 'lower-level' services would be a metaservice.  
> This might be 
> > > helpful in distinguishing between atomic services and 
> metaservices.
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: Rex Brooks [mailto:rexb@starbourne.com]
> > > Sent: Monday, February 13, 2006 10:39 AM
> > > To: McGregor.Wesley@tbs-sct.gc.ca; soa-rm@lists.oasis-open.org
> > > Subject: RE: [soa-rm] What Is A "Metaservice"?
> > >
> > > Good point Wes,
> > >
> > > Would it make an errata? Just to pre-empt the obvious.
> > >
> > > Regards,
> > > Rex
> > >
> > > P.S. What would the equivalent be in a bus or a fabric? 
> Can I build 
> > > a server for it? Does it do Windows?
> > >
> > > At 9:57 AM -0500 2/13/06, <McGregor.Wesley@tbs-sct.gc.ca> wrote:
> > >> Hi Joe,
> > >>
> > >> The definition of "meta-service" would be dependent on 
> the context 
> > >> in which it is used IMHO.
> > >>
> > >> I would note however that some company will define it 
> soon, publish 
> > >> it, and that definition (even if erroneous) may be THE 
> definition.
> > >>
> > >> To simply ignore the inevitable is to put our heads in the sand.
> > >>
> > >> A service about services seems logically equivalent to data about
> > > data.
> > >>
> > >> Do we need to say more?
> > >>
> > >> Regards,
> > >>
> > >> Wes
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Rex Brooks
> > > President, CEO
> > > Starbourne Communications Design
> > > GeoAddress: 1361-A Addison
> > > Berkeley, CA 94702
> > > Tel: 510-849-2309
> > >
> >-------------------------------------------------------------
> ----------
> >-
> >------------------
> >Ken Laskey
> >MITRE Corporation, M/S H305     phone:  703-983-7934
> >7515 Colshire Drive                        fax:        703-983-1379
> >McLean VA 22102-7508
> 
> --
>       
> --------------------------------------------------------------
> -------------------
>    /   Ken 
> Laskey                                                        
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>    \   McLean VA 22102-7508                                   
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