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Subject: Re: [wsrp] [wsia] [wsrp-wsia joint interfaces] agenda for Tuesday 11June

Without touching on the subsequent discussions already underway this 
morning, I find myself at sea wrt session management. In Rich's reply 
to Eilon's first comment on the merged document yesterday, Rich said,

"To ask your questions about sessions in a stronger way:
  - Can a Consumer FORCE a Producer to do sessions in a manner the Producer
does not want?
This would include either requiring sharing OR requiring session
independence. I think the answer has to be no. The Consumer does get to
indicate preference (it is where the knowledge of the aggregated page lives
and this is often important in guiding these decisions), but in the end the
Producer is the one who creates and manages sessions..."

I'm less concerned about the mechanics of a session than about the 
process, which I understood, going back to your diagram of states and 
arcs, Alan, as originating with a user request. This does not create 
a session, as I understand it, but does start the process, which 
moves up the chain of arcs to the producer, who creates the session 
when information starts to flow back down the chain of arcs of the 

The entity, as I understood it, was what we named the thingy which 
could be persistent or transient, was effectively an instance of the 
service between producer and consumer that gets activated by a 
session. We called it an entity to avoid the overloaded term 
instance. I understood entity to be the collection of properties, 
usually referred to as a container in WSRP terms, that could include 
a number of portlets.

Much of the subsequent discussion between Carsten and Gil appears to 
be concerned with what looks to me to be a very muddy situation where 
consumers are now creating sessions and entities, which stands at 
odds with what I quoted above from Rich.

I would have been happy to see the process diagram we spoke about, so 
that we can always be sure we are talking about the same things.

I would really like to see that diagram.


At 4:54 PM -0700 6/10/02, Alan Kropp wrote:
>I think we'll have plenty of discussion around the merged document Rich and
>Carsten put together.
>The two main issues I see that have arisen on the email lists are:
>1.  What is the difference between transient entities and sessions, and is
>there enough of a distinction to warrant including both in the
>2.  There are efficiency concerns around the use of arrays in the method
>signatures, basically to enable batched requests for network efficiency. 
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