Notes from the OASIS
WSRF TC teleconference
21st February 2005
Roll call
The roll call is kept on the TC web site
under the meeting record.
See http://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/wsrf/event.php?event_id=4814
Minute Taker: David
Levine
Not quarate yet
Approval of minutes from the face-to-face meeting (21st
February)
See http://www.oasis-open.org/committees/download.php/11527
There were no comments on the minutes and no objections to
approving them.
AOB?
None
Action review
Actions have taken places
on the issues list, per the
f2f Specs largely
updated, Service group still being worked on
Charter Change vote
initiated -- reminder to vote, so we can have 75% of members to remove
renewable refernces specification from the deliverables.
WIKI site -- nothing done
as yet carry forward
SG signed up to be link
with Obix committee (done)
Points on action items? -
None.
New issues
BM: new issues
97 -- Query RP port
type, doesn't contain attributes which points to XML
schema, needs to be added
to that porttype (WSRP resource properties
attribute) Open - not quorate
98 -- cardinality of Set
resource property content
Shouldn't minoccurs
be one? -- prevents vacuous resource property
commands
sg: What breaks
if it is? - nothing, but nonsensical. Move to
open
99 -- Non normative
examples in spec us soap 1.2 namespace. Should we be
using soap 1.1 namespace
instead? (What should go in the interop doc?)
WSIBP 1.1 compliant, need
to be soap 1.1 namespace) So examples should
match. -- Open
100 - Confusion about
requirement that WS-Basefaults for WS-Resources -
Raised by Ian Springer,
Steve Graham. SG: Every fault must be
derivative/should be
derivative of base fault. (Wording improvements?)
Tied up with cleanup of
wording around... clairfy text May need a
little more text in first
bullet senstance to make clear, and stronger -- Open
End of new issues
Next f2f
Dubln capacity too small
for meeting. Palo Alto SAP
Begining of week 16-may
Noon Monday to Noon Wednesday, WSN in same
venue to follow Umit and
Sanjay to handle logistics. (Instructuions, etc)
ServiceGroup usage and requirements
Two presentations:
Sam, heather Kreger
Service group usage
and requirements (Both on web site)
Heather first:
How we use SG in WSDM,
and in a mapping for DMTF to CIM
How to expose
resources for management as web services
Key aspects: Composability,
exhibit behavior of a collection,
provide common
concepts (Identity, Discovery, Advertisement) SG
groups come in
here.
WSDM mostly focused
on how to manage the resource, compelled to
provide some advice
and recommendation (non-normative) how to do
discovery and advertisement
(Recommend SGs)
Wrap existing
management registries with SG
Basic properties an
resources to use in this case (basic interop
and searchable
properties) Identity from WSDM-MUWS, Resource ID,
Manage Characteristics,
manage capabilities. (URI list of management
capabilities that
resource exposes)
Find by property/property
values as well as capabilities.
Difficult to
restrict/search using same content rule
Able to put all WSFM manageable
resources into registries, beyond
first few properties,
everything else was resource specific. (Need some
way to allow people
to add any type of service to a group, still be able
to search sparsely
populated properties) (somewhat tricky
Be able to define a
rule that you must have ID, capabilities, then
need properties in
content rule, or can't search.
Creation events, when
bringing them into the environment, use
resource ID to
register into the local SG. (Don't talk about how
to populate -- sort
of implied that there is a registry mechanism)
Either register to
get notification, or periodically poll for new
ones.
Bootstrapping issues
-- how do you find first SG location. Several
ways you can do this,
for example UDDI, none recommended
Consider separate
membership content/query rules Possibly think
about support for
sparsely populated values.
Using CIM - slide 9
Move arrows on slide 9 from
proprietary to Web Services
Slide 10 - common
properties for the arrows on slide 9 (What they do)
Slide 11 - Examples of
queries we want to be able to do no the model.
CIM query
language (Not to be confused with SQL) Work to be
done to synch
up with Xpath.
Slide 12 - Cim server
becomes general management server.
US WS
protocols to talk to the resources, and talk to
resources with
non CIM models. (See bottom 2, in blue)
Slide 13- Use red
highlighted WSRF stuff to get those jobs done in WSDM
in the web
services mapping
Sldie 14 - WR-WN for
application pattern, CIM for model, WSDM for
operations model
Slide 15- Either via
WS_RF or SMASH (command line interface) using CIM
Diff CIM/Smash
(Command line vs. exposed CIM provider)
models
Does management
application see the difference between CIM/SMash,
When doing WS-*
should be the same whether CIM or SMASH (hk)
Today, Yes, when
moving to WS, no. (hk)
Slide 16 - Resource
mapping -- locate all classes which look like
manageable resources,
almost all from managed system element,
represent that as a WSDM maagble
resource. Supports WS-RP and
Resource-ID *(from WSDM)
took all propereties in those classes and they
become resource propeerties,
all operations to WSDL operations
Slide 17 - Associated
data (Reresent hese as straight WS-Resources)
assocaued withWSFM
managed resource, with a relationship
Sldie 18 - Instances colletcion
(service group) General collections)
Slide 19 -
"Interesting one" Created classes collection, to as,
questions about the
classes and and thier instances. Classes in the
model have on properties
and operations For each fo these claases,
service group of call
instances of the class Can get all instances of a
class, and all instanbces
of all descendents
For class X , list
class 1 and class2 as superclass, locate all
places where class X
occurs to find the descendents
Hierchy is kept in
resource properties.
3 collections - very similar
proposal was brough forward by another
proposal group on the
team.
How to federate CIMOMs to
get larger resource domanis you can search
over. Can use this as a
federation so that you have these collections
span multiple CIMOMs with
virtually no n changs in arch.
Slide 20 - What presented
to DMTF
Corellateable
properties so can understand name in the CIM
community.
skip to Slide 23 - Use
service group queires (red) to enumerate stuff
Slide 24 - Again, use SG
queries to enumerate classes.
Query vs. content rules
discussion - What's searchable? HK, only what's
in the content rule is
searchable. (Her reading) Content vs searchable
should be two different
rules (Desire)
Sam's pitch:
Slide 1: Grouping -- Even
for discovering and modeling part, is essential part
they want form the spec. Lightweight
way to group WS-Resources together.
Important to have lease
based lifetime mechanisms for robustness in
distributed settings
Ability to drive
operations across multiple WS-resources
Like to see example/clarification
of how to drive an operation across
multiple instances though
a service group
Example which clarifies
the use case would be welcome
Explicitly address an
example of this in the Spec or appnotes.
Ties to issue 64. (need a
mechanism)
Slide 2: Registry
Regsitry, including
very dynamic information
May want to discover
all queue lengths for seeveral schedules, with
dynamic infomrationa
reqt: How information
gets published into the regsitry (push vs.
pull) should be
spec agnostic. A few examples of the pull.
(e.g. regsiter
EPR, and do periodic pull)
Possibly to
things out of band (calculate latancy for all
members, using
non WS emchanisms)
Uniform query i/f
across both RP and Service groups. -- need leaf
based content/lifetime
management to do this.
(Aside, UDDI doesn't meet
these requirements)
Slide 3- Existing
implementations
Index service - arbitrary
operation performed on all registrants
Trigger service - register
with it, pluggable/deployed action that
happens on value change
notification on any of the entries.
Archive services - Serves
as querable over time archive fo values via
notification
Would like to use service
groups to drive WSRF actions across group of
regsitrants
Q&A: None
---------
(2 new joins to the
meeting, so now quorate)
Issues Review
WSRF44: No obvious mechanism to include only members which extend a certain
interface
We believe Tom Maguire as
action to on this, posptone, until we hear from tom. Tom has action item to
make proposal
Action: Tom to respond,
hopefully with a proposal
WSRF58: ServiceGroup WSDL does not need imports for WSRF-RL WSDL/schema
Spec doesn't references
WSDL/Schema, needs to Approach at
f2f was thought this was
overkill, just use similar schema Remove
imports from WSDL
document -- (Agreed to move all of XSD into an XSD
file, so should be easy)
No objections - Editors to do. (resolved)
WSRD-59 (Editorial level details in Service group doc.) e.g. property
missing of a UML diagram.
Discussion about
controversial level. Is non-controversial, expect for
unsupported i/f fault,
which should be withdrawn. - Resolve to pass the
rest to the editors to
implement.
Resolved in issue 60.
(Close no action) Bryan Will talk to
developers, to make sure
it is correct.
WSRF66: Discovery of schema for a dynamic resource property
mechanism to aggregate
operation across several resources in a service group
SG: talked about for
a while. Send a message to a SG, have the
message invoked upon consituuent
members.
q: How do we aggrgeate
the resposne
q: How to we
handle faults
- if only
some understand the WSDL, do I invoke on all,
some, ignroe
faults, etc.
- correlate
the responses? Do I wait for all responses,
etc.
TB: Did this
come from a homogenous service group context?
Sg: How would
uniform service group get enforced
Martin: Thought
we decided beyond scope.
Was mentioned in
Sam's foil set.
Want to be able
to apply management operations across mulitple
resources.
OGSA doesn't specifiy
aggregation of response/faults
Just end them a
message -- With notification, some notion of
having subscribed
to the topic. -- many messages are request resposne,
so doesn't help
there.
Martin - if we do
this, we can get bogged down.
sg: service group
may allow an optimization point (e.g. service
group which holds
the resource, so can locally do it)
(Latha?) Collection
of identiifies - however represented -- may not
yield themselves into
a well encapsulated service group Seems
like using a
service group adds another step to the process.
(e.g. can create
set of IDs, without making them correspond to a
single service
group)
Becomes a
question (struggle with OGSA will they adopt WSRF
implied resource
pattern or not) One missing piece is iterator to do
these sorts of
things
Sam willing to go
off an work on a propsal, Tom as well, Dave
Snelling as well.
Action: on these people to do so.
All new specs
uploaded, as seoon as we have service group, will
have ballot to
adopt these drafts as drafts. Need to make sure
we have read
those drafts well enough to consider all issues
closed by these
drafts to be closed. e.g.
Action: by all to review current
drafts. Final reviews needed now.
Straggler's role call.
Close.
Summary of actions
(Chairs) Investigate WIKI site for
Developing AppNotes (carried forward from 4th Feb)
(Bryan) Move issues 97, 98,99 and 100 to
‘Open’.
(TomM) Respond, hopefully with a proposal
to resolve issue wsrf44.
(Bryan) Move issues 58, 59 to resolved.
(Sam, TomM, DaveS) Propose resolution to
issue 66.
(All) Review current drafts. Final reviews
needed are now.