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Subject: Re: [sca-bpel] Formatted minutes of 2008-05-15 telcon
This time with the roll. -Anish -- Anish Karmarkar wrote: > Attached. > Thanks to Martin for scribing. > Note: these minutes do not contain the roll -- so we can't approve them > (yet). > > -Anish > -- > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > Hide IRC > > OASIS Logo <http://www.oasis-open.org/> > > > - DRAFT - > > > OASIS SCA-BPEL TC telcon > > > 15 MAY 2008 > > > Attendees > > Present > TBD > Chair > Sanjay Patil > Scribe > Martin Chapman > Agenda: > http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-bpel/200805/msg00009.html > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > Contents > > <#topics>Topics > [1] <#d1e123> Agenda > [2] <#d1e128> minutes > [3] <#d1e136> action items > [4] <#d1e165> new issues > [5] <#d1e169> Status of JIRA > [6] <#d1e177> Issue 20 > [7] <#d1e204> issue 15 > Table of Resolutions <#resolutions> > Table of Action Items <#ais> > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > Action Items > > New: > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > Resolutions > > * 2008-05-15-1 <#d1e200>: Issue 20 resolved by proposal at > http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-bpel/200805/msg00016.html > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > Minutes > > Scribe: Martin Chapman > > <Sanjay> > Agenda - > 1. Roll Call > http://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/sca-bpel/members/roster.php > 2. Appointment of scribe > Scribe list attached below > 3. Agenda bashing > 4. Approval of may 8, 2008 minutes > http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-bpel/200805/msg00007.html > 5. Action items review > http://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/sca-bpel/members/action_items.php > a) AI #0021 > Chairs - to follow up with Mary to post the CD docs to OASIS repository > b) AI #0035 (Due date 5/ > Dieter - Create a proposal for Issue 16 - Ambiguous Service Resolution > c) AI #0037 > Anish - update the assembly RDDL file, file names and the references in > the spec > d) AI #0039 > Anish - Provide an amendment to Danny's proposal to resolve issue 20. > 6. New Issues > NONE > 7. Status of JIRA > Update from issues editor > 8. Issue Discussion > a) Issue 20 http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/BPEL-20 > SCA-BPEL spec can not require bpel:mustUnderstand to be true > (proposal in JIRA) > b) Issue 15 http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/BPEL-15 > TITLE- Define Conformance Targets > SUBMITTED BY- Martin Chapman > http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-bpel/200803/msg00000.html > http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-bpel/200803/msg00014.html > http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-bpel/200803/msg00048.html > http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-bpel/200804/msg00001.html > http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-bpel/200804/msg00021.html > Review of section 2.1 from CD-01-rev3 at > http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-bpel/200804/msg00026.html > c) Issue 18 http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/BPEL-18 > TITLE- Need to rewrite the SCA-BPEL specifications with RFC-2119 > keywords/statements > SUBMITTED BY- KHANDERAO KAND > d) Issue 16 http://osoa.org/jira/browse/BPEL-16 > TITLE- Ambigous Service Resolution > SUBMITTED BY- Dieter Koenig > 9. AOB > <Mike Edwards> > your line is very noisy Martin > > > Agenda > > > no additions. Approved > > > minutes > > > Approval of may 8, 2008 minutes > http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-bpel/200805/msg00007.html > > no comments and no objections to approving > > > action items > > > a) AI #0021 > Chairs - to follow up with Mary to post the CD docs to OASIS repository > > Ongoing > > b) AI #0035 (Due date 5/ > Dieter - Create a proposal for Issue 16 - Ambiguous Service Resolution > > extended complietion date to may 29. Ongoing > > c) AI #0037 > Anish - update the assembly RDDL file, file names and the references in > the spec > > Need to touch base with Ivana on the BPEL RDDL file > > Done > > d) AI #0039 > Anish - Provide an amendment to Danny's proposal to resolve issue 20. > > Done > > > new issues > > > No new issues recieved > > > Status of JIRA > > > is up to date with current status. > Anish: > need to upload a snapshot to the TC pages > > Mike R will do > > > Issue 20 > > > Issue 20 http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/BPEL-20 > SCA-BPEL spec can not require bpel:mustUnderstand to be true > (proposal in JIRA) > <anish> > amendment: > http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-bpel/200805/msg00016.html > <Danny> > Sanjay - can you mark me present, please. > <Sanjay> > yes Danny > Martin: > does the extension need a name? > <Danny> > not accoriding to ws-bpel syntax > Anish moves to accept proposal in msg00016.html to resolve issue 20. > Danny 2nds > > No objcections to unanimous consent, motion passes. > *Resolution: *Issue 20 resolved by proposal at > http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-bpel/200805/msg00016.html > > Issue 20 can be moved to resolved state > > > issue 15 > > > Issue 15 http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/BPEL-15 > TITLE- Define Conformance Targets > SUBMITTED BY- Martin Chapman > http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-bpel/200803/msg00000.html > http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-bpel/200803/msg00014.html > http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-bpel/200803/msg00048.html > http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-bpel/200804/msg00001.html > http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-bpel/200804/msg00021.html > Review of section 2.1 from CD-01-rev3 at > http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-bpel/200804/msg00026.html > <anish> > issue 18 http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-bpel/200804/msg00026.html > Mike R: > walk thru of section 2.1 update proposal > <Danny> > ". A simple static analysis of the control flow, which does not involve > determining the values of any expressions, is used > to determine which role can send the first message." > > thanks > Sanjay: > has been a dicussion on static analysis so may need to raise a separate > issue. > <anish> > i don't like 'component type generator' and 'component' as the > conformance targets > <anish> > the targets we should have are specific files or runtime > <anish> > i don't know what i can do with a 'component type generator' target > > well we can talk about elements being targets i.e. portions of documents > <anish> > sure, but the target is still the composite > <Danny> > I disagree. Otherwise we get all kinds of passive syntax > <anish> > this is/was done in WS-I, and the syntax was not bad > Danny: > need a discussion about static ananlysis and whether its an issue > Martin: > Component Type generator is not a traget we should be talking about > Martin: > its not something we wish to attach conformance requiremenst to > Anish: > hard to see attaching tests to a component type generator. prefer > talking about the sca runtime > Mike E: > sympathize with not liking the component type generator. > <anish> > how about 'the RUNTIME MUST generate the component type that ...' > > there is a notial/virtual data structure being produced and we can talk > about production rules without talking about > generators > Mike R: > didnt seem appropriate for an artifact nor a run-time > <Dieter Koenig> > how about "a component type referencing this process MUST contain an SCA > service ..."? > <Mike Edwards> > "the introspected component type MUST...." > Mike R: > sca runtime is too late in the process in this case > Anish: > suggested sca runtime could do this > Anish: > hard to mandate when checks are made or virtual data structure is created > Mike R: > does the compontent type generator imply any time in the process > Anish: > no but implying targeting a particular part of the run-time which is > hard to isolate > Dieter: > focus on the artifacts and the rules between them, and not fucuss of > runtimes and generators > Martin C: > +1 to Dieter > Sanjay: > component type generator may be good for ease of writting but may give > wrong impression for how to implement > Sanjay: > with the virtual artifact it doesnt actually exist, however it shoudl be > testable somehow > Mike E: > it is still prefectly testable as you can depend on certain values being > present. This is valid for any technology > that does introspection and is not just specific to BPEL > Mike R: > something should be claiming to pass a test > Mike R: > cant have a non existing artifact to test > Mike R: > doesnt imply any point in time the generator must execute > <anish> > mikeR, what did you think of my suggestion in the chat? > Martin C: > generator is too virtual > Mike E: > how is a generator more testable than a virtual file > Mike R: > entities at any point in time can claim to be a generator > Mike E: > not real enough > Anish: > can we substitute runtime for generator > Mike R: > would prefer the runtime approach to Mike E and Dieter's approach > <Dieter Koenig> > i can write a component type with notepad - what is the runtime in this > case? > Sanjay: > who do we make happy talking about genererors > > dos? > <anish> > dieter, that is a sidefile, i assume, in which case it is a valid target > <anish> > any such file has to be merged with things like annotations, extensions > <anish> > which would generate a virtual CT > <anish> > so, RUNTIME is a target, SCDL is a target, CT side file is a target, > BPEL process is a target > > Motions to adopt: > http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-bpel/200803/msg00000.html > > Ran out of time so motion dies > > Aob: stragler roll call > > [End of Minutes] > Formatted on 2008-05-21 at 14:21:40 GMT-7 > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Minutes formatted by Schreiber, a collection of XSLT stylesheets by Bob > Freund modeled after David Booth's scribe > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > Schreiber diagnostics output > > [Delete this section before publishing the minutes] > > citation-detection-scribed: Line 258: Check for possible unrecognized > nick 'Motions to adopt' > > citation-detection-scribed: Line 262: Check for possible unrecognized > nick 'Aob' > > statistics: Schreiber found 159 input lines > > edits: Schreiber found the following text-edit commands: > > edits: Line 101: MartinC: s/RDDL/BPEL RDDL/ > > edits: Line 168: anish: s/generetor/generator/ > > command-scribe: Line 2: Martin Chapman recognized > > command-scribe: Schreiber detected that this section was scribed online > > citation-detection-irc1: Line 13: Check for possible unrecognized nick > 'http' > > citation-detection-irc1: Line 21: Check for possible unrecognized nick > 'http' > > citation-detection-irc1: Line 24: Check for possible unrecognized nick > 'http' > > citation-detection-irc1: Line 44: Check for possible unrecognized nick > 'a) Issue 20 http' > > citation-detection-irc1: Line 48: Check for possible unrecognized nick > 'b) Issue 15 http' > > citation-detection-irc1: Line 51: Check for possible unrecognized nick > 'http' > > citation-detection-irc1: Line 52: Check for possible unrecognized nick > 'http' > > citation-detection-irc1: Line 53: Check for possible unrecognized nick > 'http' > > citation-detection-irc1: Line 54: Check for possible unrecognized nick > 'http' > > citation-detection-irc1: Line 55: Check for possible unrecognized nick > 'http' > > citation-detection-irc1: Line 57: Check for possible unrecognized nick > 'http' > > citation-detection-irc1: Line 59: Check for possible unrecognized nick > 'c) Issue 18 http' > > citation-detection-irc1: Line 64: Check for possible unrecognized nick > 'd) Issue 16 http' > > citation-detection-irc1: Line 80: Check for possible unrecognized nick > 'http' > > edit-substitute: command on line 101 succeeded, changed line 99 from > 'RDDL' to 'BPEL RDDL' > > edit-delete: Line 101 was deleted > > citation-detection-irc1: Line 147: Check for possible unrecognized nick > 'http' > > citation-detection-irc1: Line 148: Check for possible unrecognized nick > 'http' > > citation-detection-irc1: Line 149: Check for possible unrecognized nick > 'http' > > citation-detection-irc1: Line 150: Check for possible unrecognized nick > 'http' > > citation-detection-irc1: Line 151: Check for possible unrecognized nick > 'http' > > citation-detection-irc1: Line 153: Check for possible unrecognized nick > 'http' > > edit-substitute: command on line 168 succeeded, changed line 166 from > 'generetor' to 'generator' > > edit-delete: Line 168 was deleted > > system: Transformer: SAXON 9.0.0.2 > > [End of Schreiber diagnostic output] > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from this mail list, you must leave the OASIS TC that > generates this mail. You may a link to this group and all your TCs in OASIS > at: > https://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/portal/my_workgroups.phpTitle: SCA-BPEL - 2008-05-15
Scribe: Martin Chapman
[End of Minutes]
Formatted on 2008-05-21 at 15:00:03 GMT-7
citation-detection-scribed: Line 267: Check for possible unrecognized nick 'Motions to adopt'
citation-detection-scribed: Line 271: Check for possible unrecognized nick 'Aob'
statistics: Schreiber found 169 input lines
edits: Schreiber found the following text-edit commands:
edits: Line 110: MartinC: s/RDDL/BPEL RDDL/
edits: Line 177: anish: s/generetor/generator/
command-scribe: Line 2: Martin Chapman recognized
command-scribe: Schreiber detected that this section was scribed online
citation-detection-irc1: Line 22: Check for possible unrecognized nick 'http'
citation-detection-irc1: Line 30: Check for possible unrecognized nick 'http'
citation-detection-irc1: Line 33: Check for possible unrecognized nick 'http'
citation-detection-irc1: Line 53: Check for possible unrecognized nick 'a) Issue 20 http'
citation-detection-irc1: Line 57: Check for possible unrecognized nick 'b) Issue 15 http'
citation-detection-irc1: Line 60: Check for possible unrecognized nick 'http'
citation-detection-irc1: Line 61: Check for possible unrecognized nick 'http'
citation-detection-irc1: Line 62: Check for possible unrecognized nick 'http'
citation-detection-irc1: Line 63: Check for possible unrecognized nick 'http'
citation-detection-irc1: Line 64: Check for possible unrecognized nick 'http'
citation-detection-irc1: Line 66: Check for possible unrecognized nick 'http'
citation-detection-irc1: Line 68: Check for possible unrecognized nick 'c) Issue 18 http'
citation-detection-irc1: Line 73: Check for possible unrecognized nick 'd) Issue 16 http'
citation-detection-irc1: Line 89: Check for possible unrecognized nick 'http'
edit-substitute: command on line 110 succeeded, changed line 108 from 'RDDL' to 'BPEL RDDL'
edit-delete: Line 110 was deleted
citation-detection-irc1: Line 156: Check for possible unrecognized nick 'http'
citation-detection-irc1: Line 157: Check for possible unrecognized nick 'http'
citation-detection-irc1: Line 158: Check for possible unrecognized nick 'http'
citation-detection-irc1: Line 159: Check for possible unrecognized nick 'http'
citation-detection-irc1: Line 160: Check for possible unrecognized nick 'http'
citation-detection-irc1: Line 162: Check for possible unrecognized nick 'http'
edit-substitute: command on line 177 succeeded, changed line 175 from 'generetor' to 'generator'
edit-delete: Line 177 was deleted
system: Transformer: SAXON 9.0.0.2
[End of Schreiber diagnostic output]
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