RE:[legaldocml] RE:[legaldocml] Two similar tags: alinea and intro

Hello Grant,

In fact, in EU tradition (where, as you know, each act is in 23 languages), we have also the following convention for paragraph/alinea :

the EN "paragraph" is a "paragraphe" in FR if numbered or an "alinea" if not numbered.
And an "alinea" in FR is a "paragraph" in EN if it is a subdivision of the Article or a "subparagraph" in EN if it is a subdivision of a (numbered) paragraph.

Also for the "point" structure, the english is a too simple model ;-) : in english, there is point (a), point (1), or point (i) but, for example, in spain, they use punto (1), letra (a) and inciso (i).

Also for the numbering, there are some mapping : "article 1bis" in some language is "article 1a" in other language ... It depends on local traditions.

Kind regards

Véronique

De : grant.vergottini@gmail.com [grant.vergottini@gmail.com] de la part de Grant Vergottini [grant.vergottini@xcential.com]
Envoyé : mercredi 15 mai 2013 17:03
À : PARISSE, Véronique
Cc : legaldocml@lists.oasis-open.org
Objet : Re: [legaldocml] RE:[legaldocml] Two similar tags: alinea and intro

Hmm, ok. I looked up "alinea" in the dictionary:

In Italian, "alinea" seems to mean "introduction".

In French, "alinea" seems to mean "paragraph".

In Spanish, "alinea" seems to mean "aligns" or "lines".

In English, "alinea" doesn't mean anything at all.

Last week I asked Monica, an Italian speaker, what the <alinea> tag was for and she described it as introductory text, leading to my confusion with the <intro> tag.

This week Véronique, a French speaker, describes the <alinea> tag as useful for unnumbered paragraphs.

Fabio described <alinea> elements as a unnumbered hierarchical construct, which I believe is similar to Véronique's definition.

I have come across unnumbered paragraphs myself. In my cases, they've typically found in sections or lower levels. I think they're usually either a simple case where the paragraphs in a section aren't numbered for some reason or they're an oddity resulting from awkward amending of numbered paragraphs. In these cases, I was not considering them to be a hierarchical construct but rather a simple continuation paragraph belonging to their parent hierarchical element - and for this I was using the <p> element. For instance:

<p>This is the first unnumbered paragraph</p>

<p>This is the second unnumbered paragraph</p>

</content>

</section>

This is the first text.
<p>This is the continuation paragraph.</p>

</content>

</paragraph>

The way I now understand <alinea> to be used is as follows:

This is the first paragraph.

</content>

</paragraph>

This is the unnumbered paragraph.

</content>

</alinea>

To me, the semantics here are quite different. The <alinea> tag, if I am applying it differently, separates its text from the prior <paragraph> whereas in my prior example, the <p> tag continued the text of the <paragraph>.

Perhaps we need some more clarification on the <alinea> tag. I know we discussed this once before, but I don't think I had the right context to understand the discussion fully at that time.

-Grant

On Tue, May 14, 2013 at 11:32 AM, PARISSE, Véronique <V.PARISSE@aubay.lu> wrote:

Hello Grant,

I use "alinea", in the markup of my document for unumbered paragraph inside another structure (like point). It is a french inheritance ;-)
I only use the "intro" for the first sentence of a list, generally ended by a ":" (we called it "introductory part")

Kind regards

Véronique

De : legaldocml@lists.oasis-open.org [legaldocml@lists.oasis-open.org] de la part de Grant Vergottini [grant.vergottini@xcential.com]
Envoyé : mardi 14 mai 2013 20:07
À : legaldocml@lists.oasis-open.org
Objet : [legaldocml] Two similar tags: alinea and intro

What is the difference between the <alinea> and <intro> tags? My current understanding seems to make them be the same thing - variously also called a "chapeau" (Canada), an "umbrella" (Canada), "introductory text" (US House), or "top bread" (Hong Kong).

Also, the tag <wrap> seems to be a bit Hollywood slang'ish. Wouldn't <wrapUp> be a bit better. The other terms I have found for this is "continuation text" (US House) or "bottom bread" (Hong Kong).

How should a proviso be handled? I've seen cases where there is a wrap up and then if continues with a follow-on paragraph "Providing that...." That seems to be generally called a proviso and amendment language often reads "In the proviso of Section..." Should it have it's own tag?

-- Grant
____________________________________________________________________
Grant Vergottini
Xcential Group, LLC.
email: grant.vergottini@xcential.com
phone: 858.361.6738

--
____________________________________________________________________
Grant Vergottini
Xcential Group, LLC.
email: grant.vergottini@xcential.com
phone: 858.361.6738

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