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Subject: OpenDocument TC coordination call minutes 2007-04-01

* Roll Call

Robert Weir, IBM
Helen Yue, IBM
David Faure, KDE
Patric Durusau
Florian Reueter, Novell
Michael Brauer, Sun Microsystems
Lars Oppermann, Sun Microsystems
Eike Rathke, Sun Microsystems
Oliver Wittmann, Sun Microsystems
Gary Edwards, OpenDocument Foundation
David A. Wheeler, OpenDocument Foundation

* Minutes from last coordination-call
The attending TC members unanimously accepted the minutes from the last

* Action items
(Document settings), reposted by David, follow up from Michael needed

* Announcements
No call next week (easter holidays) April 9
Call in two weeks overlaps OASIS symposium. Proposed to have a work call 
April 16
New conference call number starting April 15. New number will be posted

* Proposals ready for approval
** Linking form controls to table cells
no objections
RESULTION: the TC accepts the proposal:

** rounded corners of rectangles (draw:corner-radius)
no objections
RESULTION: the TC accepts the proposal:

** table cell matrix correction
no objections
RESULTION: the TC accepts the proposal:

** form control repeat delay
no objections
RESULTION: the TC accepts the proposal:

** Additions to negative paragraph margins
... tab-stop, list-indent
no objections
RESULTION: the TC accepts the proposal:

** proposals about existing formatting properties
bg-color (currently only for paragraphs)
no objections
RESULTION: the TC accepts the proposal:

* proposals under discussion

** citation related proposals
... must wait for metadata spec

** complex?...
Action, Michael to compile list of attributes...

* Lists
Michael: posted roadmap I posted tries to address current confusion.
no objections to roadmap
see: http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/office/200703/msg00362.html

* Backwards compatibility
Michael: there is sometimes conflict between enhancing the spec and 
keeping it backwards compatible
We should separate this discussion from discussions of specific proposals
Rob: key is to set some expectations and make a statement about what is 
compatible and what not.
Should be able to say "this update is compatible except fot these features"
Michael: we could take the list that you compiled and add additional items
Rob: when we get to a draft, we could create a diff-view of the scema 
and annotate that with information about compatibility.
Lars: is it sufficient to only look at the schema
Rob: we also need to look at the next (e.g. encryption)
Michael: it sounds reasonable that when we continue to work on the 
specification that we keep track of changes in a different way. 
Recording how changes effect compatibility.
Michael: should we continue the discussion about compatibility 
expectation or are we all in-line with what Rob and Lars said on the 
mailing list
Rob: I would like to ensure that light-weight application can continue 
to function. Handling the changes in large applications is not so much 
of a problem.
We should not add too much complexity by adding more ways of doing the 
same thing.
If we think back a few years to VC++ and C++ compilers. VC++ was not 
very compliant. However, microsoft was able to get developers to use 
their tools because they were easier to use although they did not cover 
the full standard. Hence, we should take care that ODF does not become 
to complex
Michael: so a pragmatic view would be, to say - a 1.1 application should 
be able to open a 1.2 document that does not use any 1.2 features.
Rob: a documentation of design principles would be helpful here.
DavidF: its even more difficult to write such a document out of the blue 
as it stands now.
Rob: we should at least record principles that evolve during discussions 
as we move forward
Michael: compatibility could be one chapter of such a document
Rob: I can produce a draft for such a document
Florian: which points did you have in mind
Rob: global issues such as
what is our standpoint when re-using other standards
what is our relationship to major applications
Florian: do you have something in mind about the layout
Lars: final presentation...
Patrick: I had a long discussion on this
there is a preception, that if I go from one application that when I go 
from one ODF app to another that the presentation should look roughly alike
Rob: some things look close enough others have problems....
DavidW: we should describe something like "industry expectation"
Rob: layout decisions are deferred to the application (font kerning...)
... create a first draft of this document in the wiki
start with compatibility topic
propose TOC.

* New Action Items
Rob: post draft for design principles document, starting with backwards 
compatibility topic (and outline for other parts)
All: submit List proposals by April 5th.

Lars Oppermann <lars.oppermann@sun.com>               Sun Microsystems
Software Engineer                                         Nagelsweg 55
Phone: +49 40 23646 959                         20097 Hamburg, Germany
Fax:   +49 40 23646 550                  http://www.sun.com/staroffice

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