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Subject: Re: [office] RE: Directories in Zip packages
Hi Rob, robert_weir@us.ibm.com wrote: > Given a ZIP entry of: A/B > > How do we know whether: > > B is an empty directory in A > > versus > > B is a zero byte file in A? > > I thought A/B was a file and A/B/ was a directory. > > That said, there is a lot of code, including libraries, out there that > doesn't follow the above rule and relies on figuring out implicitly what > directories need to be made, according to the paths encoded in non-zero > byte files. So I still think allowing zero-byte files or empty > directories is a portability concern. Is it? I mean, we have ODF since 2005, and did we ever have an issue with that? It's not that this may not be discussed, but do we really know what impact a change in this area has? Are we sure we don't break existing applications? I personally would recommend to not make such changes for ODF 1.2 as late unless we are crystal clear about the impact and the benefits. Michael > > -Rob > > > > "Dennis E. Hamilton" <dennis.hamilton@acm.org> wrote on 09/27/2010 > 05:11:41 PM: > >> RE: [office] RE: Directories in Zip packages >> >> -1 >> >> Unless there is a proposal for how to accomplish the signing of >> "directories" via XML Digital Signature (and also directory entries for >> package files, which we don't sign either). >> >> Please include a specific rule for knowing what is a directory entry in > the >> Zip, because there is no help in APPNOTE 6.2.0 that I can find. >> >> - Dennis >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Hanssens Bart [mailto:Bart.Hanssens@fedict.be] >> Sent: Monday, September 27, 2010 10:42 >> To: dennis.hamilton@acm.org; 'Svante Schubert' >> Cc: ODF TC List >> Subject: RE: [office] RE: Directories in Zip packages >> >> Arrgh :-) Folks, this is going back and forth, while I really would like > to >> see some work on XAdES :-) >> >> My suggestion: >> >> - discourage (but not forbid) the use of empty directories and empty > files >> in ODF packages >> - sign everything in the zip (including empty directories and empty > files) >> - change the 1.2 draft about document signatures and mention "sign every >> entry" instead of >> "sign every file" >> >> This means there's no impact on unsigned ODF docs (because every >> implementation can still >> use empty things, although it is discouraged) >> >> There is impact on signed implementations signing/verifying signed docs, > but >> those products >> probably have to be updated anyway (to support correct prefixes, version >> attributes etc) >> >> >> Bart >> >> >> ________________________________________ >> From: Dennis E. Hamilton [dennis.hamilton@acm.org] >> Sent: Monday, September 27, 2010 7:30 PM >> To: 'Svante Schubert' >> Cc: ODF TC List >> Subject: RE: [office] RE: Directories in Zip packages >> >> Svante, a sub-document doesn't have to be an "actual" directory in any >> literal sense. This was clear in ODF 1.0/1.1 and I know of nothing that >> requires us to change that. >> >> The sub-document <manifest:file-entry> simply has to specify a "path" > prefix >> that some of the package files share and that are treated as a > collection >> with respect to the manifest:media-type. Otherwise we would be in a > world >> of hurt with manifest:full-path="/". >> >> We don't have nor require that "META-INF/" be declared as a sub-document > or >> have a directory entry in the package, nor do we do so for "Thumbnail/" > and >> so on. >> >> When there is an ODF Package-significant use for declaring empty >> directories, we should treat it as an extension case. In the meantime, > I >> think we should give consumers a break here, especially around document >> security issues. A speculative future scenario is no help to a consumer > who >> stumbles on one of these now because of some inscrutable producer > behavior. >> - Dennis >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Svante Schubert [mailto:Svante.Schubert@oracle.com] >> Sent: Monday, September 27, 2010 09:20 >> To: office@lists.oasis-open.org >> Subject: Re: [office] RE: Directories in Zip packages >> >> On 27.09.2010 16:57, Bob Jolliffe wrote: >> >> ... >> >> So I would say that an odf producer should only produce entries > in >> the >> zipfile for non-zero-length streams (this would by default also >> excludes directories). And that each of these shall be > referenced >> in >> a full document signature. >> >> May I remind the TC, that from the perspective of the package (ODF 1.2 > part >> 3 - which can be seen as the base layer of ODF 1.2) an entity called a >> document is defined by a directory related with a media type (in the >> manifest.xml). >> >> In general I believe when a generic functionality does not hurt, it > should >> not be forbidden nor dropped as other yet unknown user scenarios might > rely >> on it. >> >> Regards, >> Svante >> >> >> -- >> >> >> <http://www.oracle.com/> >> Svante Schubert | ODF Standardization >> Phone: +49 40 23646 965 >> Oracle Office GBU >> >> ORACLE Deutschland B.V. & Co. KG | Nagelsweg 55 | 20097 Hamburg >> Hauptverwaltung: Riesstr. 25, D-80992 München >> Registergericht: Amtsgericht München, HRA 95603 >> >> Komplementärin: ORACLE Deutschland Verwaltung B.V. >> Rijnzathe 6, 3454PV De Meern, Niederlande >> Handelsregister der Handelskammer Midden-Niederlande, Nr. 30143697 >> Geschäftsführer: Jürgen Kunz, Marcel van de Molen, Alexander van der Ven >> >> <http://www.oracle.com/commitment> >> >> Oracle is committed to developing practices and products that help > protect >> the environment >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from this mail list, you must leave the OASIS TC that >> generates this mail. Follow this link to all your TCs in OASIS at: >> https://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/portal/my_workgroups.php >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from this mail list, you must leave the OASIS TC that >> generates this mail. Follow this link to all your TCs in OASIS at: >> https://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/portal/my_workgroups.php >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from this mail list, you must leave the OASIS TC that >> generates this mail. Follow this link to all your TCs in OASIS at: >> https://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/portal/my_workgroups.php >> > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from this mail list, you must leave the OASIS TC that > generates this mail. Follow this link to all your TCs in OASIS at: > https://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/portal/my_workgroups.php > -- Michael Brauer | Oracle Office Development Phone: +49 40 23646 500 Oracle Office GBU ORACLE Deutschland B.V. & Co. KG | Nagelsweg 55 | 20097 Hamburg ORACLE Deutschland B.V. & Co. KG Hauptverwaltung: Riesstr. 25, D-80992 München Registergericht: Amtsgericht München, HRA 95603 Komplementärin: ORACLE Deutschland Verwaltung B.V. Rijnzathe 6, 3454PV De Meern, Niederlande Handelsregister der Handelskammer Midden-Niederlande, Nr. 30143697 Geschäftsführer: Jürgen Kunz, Marcel van de Molen, Alexander van der Ven
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