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Subject: chat notes - ODF teleconference - 14 August 2017
Hello all, Our chat notes from the ODF Teleconference - 14 August 2017. Halfway the meeting Jos took over chair from Patrck. ==== Patrick: quorum Patrick: https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-3928 Patrick had a minor comment on this proposal, a copying error. Jos: How to handle chart rectangles for 3d charts? Camilla: how is backwards compatibility handled? Regina: LO writes svg:width and svg:height in plotarea for backwards compat. Camilla: should we not require the width and height on plot-area? Jos: specifying width and height of the plot-area allows playing with the margin Regina: LO only shows one method in the UI Regina: so the plot rectangle implies the plot-area size in LO Camilla: that should not prevent others from writing it If relation between plotarea width and height and graph rectangle is fixed, we should specify what the relationship is Patrick: if there is a single coordinate system in the coordinate-region and you do not support that, you are ok with just recording width and height in plot-area but the new proposal would make the position of the coordinate-region independent of the plot-area Regina: the proposal states that these values should be ignored if coordinate-region is supported Patrick: what is the fallback if you do not support coordinate-region? would recording width and height do any good? Regina: so you want width and height be calculated such that they are in agreement with coordinate-region? Patrick: is that possible? Jos: can we specify this calculation in the same way such that application are interoperable? Camilla: if there is such a calculation, why change the spec? Jos: so implicit in this proposal is that calculating the relationship is hard, and that positioning the coordinate-region precisely is more important Regina: If you have month on one axis and you change the label from full to one character, that will resize the coordinate-region currently with this specification, the labels can ge changed without changing coordinate-region this make it easier to align different charts Camilla: still, you could calculate the coordinate-region, so you could store all values Regina: it is convenient to have these values in macros Camilla: how do you mean? Camilla: ok it makes sense Regina: For applications that do not support this, nothing changes. Camilla: if an application does not support coordinate-region, how does the application know the sizeof the plotarea Regina: the size is calculated in the same way as now Camilla: I'm worried about applications that do not write plot-area width and height Camilla: the 'should' should be a 'must' Regina: a 'shall' Jos: the width and height of plot-area should be stored, but the coordinate-region information takes precedence if there is a conflict, when the application cannot manage to fit the plot in the size given by width and height of plotarea Jos: is the relationship hard? Regina: you need to get size and position of labels and consider the pie chart where wedge breaks out Regina: the calculation of the bounding rectangle of coordinate-region with labels is the hard part Jos: Since label size depends on font size and many other things, this calculation is hard Camilla: the dimension of the plot-area would be the bounding rectangle Jos: so is x and y in plot-area also implicit now? Jos: because labels can also be on top of coordinate-region Camilla: yes, the bounding rect is hard to calculate Jos: maybe there should be two modes? on where you fix the coordinate-region and one where you fix the plot-area? Jos because clipping and overlap are also important concerns Camilla: when would you want that? Jos: it must have seemed sensible at the time to have the plot-area specify the graph layout Camilla: having the coordinate-region at all triggers that you want the other mode Jos: indeed, it already says this: If an element <chart:coordinate-region> is present, the attributes svg:x, svg:y, svg:width and svg:height at the element <chartlot-area> shall be ignored. Camilla: with the addition that plot-area *ahall* be written for backwards compatibility, this is fine. Regina: <chart:coordinate-region> is for the underlying object, not the size of the 3d object Jos: if there are graphs where none of the walls are parallel to the document layer, what does that mean for the <chart:coordinate-region>? Regina: you can have a true 3d scene Regina: chart:three-dimensional is not specified in depth (true / false) Jos: with 'true 3d' you mean dr3d namespace things i guess Jos: those also can be applied to normal <draw:rect> etc, so there must be rule on how to deal with those Jos: svg:width on chart:floor and chart:wall are not of influence of on <chart:coordinate-region> but do affect plot-area Regina: <chart:chart> in the attached file (LO_3D_ColumnChart_12extended.fods) has 3d information in chartlot-area, but not on coordinate-region Regina: the attribute on coordinate-region are the sizes of the result of the projection Jos: the handles in LO show the bounding box around the project, that fits what Regina says Andreas: then how does that help with lining up? The handles are not where I expect them to be Jos: in the 3d case <chart:coordinate-region> is the bounding box of the axes, just like in the 2d case but in the 2d case the meaning is easier (everything is harder in 3d) The alternative would be that the front wall would correspond to <chart:coordinate-region> Regina: excel does not have the option of 3d projection Camilla we should specify how to handle the <chart:coordinate-region> in 3d Jos: should we lock the coordinate region to the front wall or to the bounding box? Regina: I will investigate before we discuss furthere Jos: If you have more questions about this spec please mail them before the next meeting? Regina: should I add the 'shall' statement? Camilla: yes With that, the meeting is suspended -- Jos van den Oever co-chair OpenDocument Format Technical Committee ..................................................................................... Ministry of the Interior and Kingdom Relations Center for Standards | Logius Wilhelmina van Pruisenweg 52 | 2595 AN | Den Haag Postbus 96810 | 2509 JE | Den Haag ..................................................................................... M +31(0)6-54715404 jos.vanden.oever@logius.nl www.logius.nl www.oasis-open.org/committees/office/ .....................................................................................
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