Re: Stable/latest url for issue list

[Robin Cover <robin@oasis-open.org>]

On Wed, 19 Oct 2005, Marc Goodner wrote:

> Hey guys.
> Robin has graciously offered to help get a stable/latest url for the
> issue list. In discussing this I realized there were some things I
> shouldn't unilaterally decide on my own on this.

Marc is referring to an informal/unofficial memo I sent on 10/12
(copied to Jamie Clark [Staff Contact] and Mary McRae ['Manager of the
docs-DOT web server' at http://docs.oasis-open.org/], after I noted
a fourth TC posting documenting the need for a stable/latest URL 
corresponding to the WS-RX TC's issues list [1].

Because Kavi creates URIs containing (unpredictable) magic numbers
of the shape /download.php/14939/MinutesWSRX-101305.htm, we can't
support (fixed/stable) "latest version" URIs, and we cannot exploit
aliasing via symbolic links:

* the magic number or key (e.g. 14939) is actually the only relevant part
  (albeit a crufty technology artifact that has no semantic value)
* 'download.php' is just the PHP query code
* the final portion (e.g., MinutesWSRX-101305.htm) is totally
  superfluous/unnecessary --  you can substitute anything
  silly in its place (veronicasSecret.png), or nothing at all

Some of us have little interest trying to build on this Kavi model
of file naming and document storage.  By contrast, the repository at 
http://docs.oasis-open.org/ is based upon a file system with
filenames/URIs under our complete control.

In this context, we can also support the notion of "latest version"
filename/URI by making use of a symlink, linked to each (successive)
version, as we have implemented for the XACML References:

http://docs.oasis-open.org/xacml/xacmlRefs.html  ['xacmlRefs.html' is a symlink]
http://docs.oasis-open.org/xacml/references/  [version-specific URIs, 
  latest in directory is the target of the symlink]

We can do the same for the WS-RX TC's issues list, e.g., with the
fixed URI matching your choice, as in [what Marc said]:

http://docs.oasis-open.org/ws-rx/issues/ReliableMessagingIssues.xml

> The location would be at http://docs.oasis-open.org/ws-rx so we need to
> make the call as to how it is linked to the latest file there.
> Particularly as there are a number of supporting files like the schema
> and xsl (which also need stable uris). So my suggestion would be the
> following (based on Robin's of course).
> 
> Get a subdirectory called issues, place all files there and symlink to
> latest version as the base filename, i.e. ReliableMessagingIssues.xml.
> So far so good, I don't think any of this is contentious. The challenge
> is we'll need to version the filename, so what are people's opinion?
> Follow the same convention as the TC docs, i.e. -nn where nn = nn + 1
> for each revision?

We can implement whatever you want: -nn works well, or -nnn if you
think you'll ever get to 100 :-)

> 
> Note this is not an automated process. Robin has offered to take on the
> burden of placing these files there whenever they are updated. Which I
> guess now I see another option. Should we just keep using Kavi and setup
> symlinks to each new version posted there? Would that be possible Robin?

I can ask the IT department (again), but the answer we have received more
than once is that we canNOT make use of symlink in connection with Kavi
resources.  We could probably use DNS+HTTP redirect from the docs-DOT
repository (from http://docs.oasis-open.org/ws-rx/<whatever> ) but that's 
not a good option: redirect involves a second server request, and the 
address that's displayed in a Web browser's address window would be the
versioned URI such as you now have. e.g.,

http://www.oasis-open.org/committees/download.php/14894/ReliableMessagingIssues.xml

You probably want people to bookmark the fixed/stable URI, but that
won't happen, as HTTP redirect will leave the Kavi versioned
URI as the bookmarkable address.  So I don't recommend HTTP redirect
in this context.

Apparently we can't get access to a real device on the Kavi file system
because the 'download.php/<magicNumber>' is masking some horribly
ugly string that's not meant for human eyes, and not intended as
a regular user file, etc.

We are in the process of automating support for "latest version" on
the docs-DOT repository, and giving TCs the ability to create
their own files/symlinks on that system.  It will probably be rolled
out in stages, the first of which would be via SSH/SCP (a kind of
"secure FTP" which also permits you to create your own symlinks).
Work in progress.

I stand by my offer to help in the interim, if you want.

**Mary/Jamie, please correct this if I've not conveyed things accurately.

Unofficially,
Robin Cover

> 
> Regards,
> 
> Marc g

[1] TC requests for persistent URL

[i]
http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/ws-rx-editors/200507/msg00010.html
July 20, 2005 - "Persistent urls for documents" - I need a persistent
URL for the issue list for our TC, and ideally any document uploaded to the
document store. The problem is that without a persistent url the old links
will remain in email archives etc. and people will not get the current
issues list (or other document). This problem gets worse in that I have
uploaded schemas and xsl that format that list. Those will change less
often but without persistent urls for those I have a lot more work to
do to update the issue list.

[ii]
http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/ws-rx-editors/200509/msg00090.html
September 28, 2005 - Maybe this was already answered but I don't
immediately see a response. It is not true that adding a document with
the same name keeps the url the same. It is actually a huge pain that
it doesn't, I'd prefer to give a url for a specific version and have
one be the latest like at W3C but that is not how Kavi works. Kavi
creates an id for each document revision that becomes part of the url.
So every time you update a doc there you get a new url, same name or not.

[iii]
http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/ws-rx-editors/200509/msg00020.html
[September 18, 2005 message responded to by Marc Goodner] "However,
there is a problem. The document name stays the same. My
understanding/assumption was that we will have individual URLs and
identifiers that reflect the version numbers. This is easily solved
with the cvs, but not here..."

[iv]
http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/ws-rx-editors/200510/msg00033.html
Marc Goodner October 12, 2005 "I try to update the issue list soon after
the minutes come out (with varying success). I will not agree to update
the issue list this any more often than this as things stand today. I
actually try not to update it more than this since it always changes the
URI of the issue list. If we can get a stable URI to the issue list I
could agree to do incremental updates in addition to the one after the
call. That would also make it a lot easier to share the responsibility
so that other editors can move their items from pending to done when
they update a draft with a resolution without making everyone in the TC
wonder if they have the latest version of the issue list. So what's
going on with CVS? Is that our answer for getting a stable URI and
making this thing easier to update?