Re: [humanmarkup] Digest Number 172

[Ranjeeth Kumar Thunga <rkthunga@humanmarkup.org>]

(cross post from YahooGroups...with an 'accidental' email deleted for
posterity ;-))

Ranjeeth Kumar Thunga
rkthunga@humanmarkup.org


>
> There are 4 messages in this issue.
>
> Topics in this digest:
>
>       1. Martians & Venusians
>            From: "Walter Hucal" <wnhucal@hotmail.com>
>       2. Re: Martians & Venusians
>            From: "Sean B. Palmer" <sean@mysterylights.com>
>       3. Re: Martians & Venusians
>            From: Niclas Olofsson <gurun@acc.umu.se>
>
>
> ________________________________________________________________________
> ________________________________________________________________________
>
> Message: 1
>    Date: Sun, 26 Aug 2001 21:21:52 -0400
>    From: "Walter Hucal" <wnhucal@hotmail.com>
> Subject: Martians & Venusians
>
> Hello all,
>
> It's not that often at all that I post to this group, but then I come
across
> something, and I'm thinking, hey, this might be something interesting to
> post to Human ML:
>
> "Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus"...  I'm sure a few of you have
> read this book by John Gray, PhD.
>
> Martians and Venusians speak different languages.  Just check out Chapter
5
> of this book.  Hey, if you can mark up the emails of all my
ex-girlfriends,
> I could sure appreciate it. ;-)  Call me a neophyte in this whole deal.
;-)
>
> Well, let me pass along a couple examples here. A woman will say "No one
> listens to me anymore".  Translated correctly into Martian, it means
> something like: "I think I'm boring you.  I would appreciate it if you
gave
> me some special attention today, I'm just extra sensitive.  Can you listen
> to me and ask supportive and caring questions for my reassurance?"  Now,
if
> a guy takes that literally, he'll hear something like: "I want someone
> exciting and interesting, and you are not that person, you are boring me
to
> death.  You dissapoint me with your selfishness and coldness!".
>
> Ouch.
>
> Here's one I remember, she said "Why are you being so nice to me?"  And
what
> I thought she was saying was something like: "I don't deserve to be
treated
> this well!  You deserve better; I am not good enough for you".  (Which
> turned out to be true anyway, LOL).  But when I asked one of my sisters to
> translate that for me, she said she meant: "You are so kind and warm and
> giving to me.  That makes me feel very special.  Tell me how special I am
to
> you!".
>
> Apparently, a guy shouldn't take what a woman says too literally.  It is
> just her dramatic way of expressing her feelings and emotions.  Did anyone
> know that?  Raise your hand...  Has this been discussed before?  If so, I
> apologize...
>
> Ok, MAYBE I am posting this to the wrong discussion group, and maybe I
> should post it to the Don Juan website instead...
>
> Later,
> -Walt
>
>
>
>
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp
>
>
>
> ________________________________________________________________________
> ________________________________________________________________________
>
> Message: 2
>    Date: Mon, 27 Aug 2001 02:38:51 +0100
>    From: "Sean B. Palmer" <sean@mysterylights.com>
> Subject: Re: Martians & Venusians
>
> > Here's one I remember, she said "Why are you being
> > so nice to me?" [...]
>
> I'd interpret that as someone who is just about to say, "if you think
> you're going to go on *another* golfing holiday, then you're very much
> mistaken", or words to that effect :-)
>
> --
> Kindest Regards,
> Sean B. Palmer
> @prefix : <http://webns.net/roughterms/> .
> :Sean :hasHomepage <http://purl.org/net/sbp/> .
>
>
>
> ________________________________________________________________________
> ________________________________________________________________________
>
> Message: 3
>    Date: Mon, 27 Aug 2001 04:00:05 +0200
>    From: Niclas Olofsson <gurun@acc.umu.se>
> Subject: Re: Martians & Venusians
>
> Walter Hucal wrote:
> > Ok, MAYBE I am posting this to the wrong discussion group, and maybe I
> > should post it to the Don Juan website instead...
>
> Hehe, mabye, mabye not. A techie point of view.
>
> Question: Who is responsible for providing the correct translation. The
> sender or the reciever. I take it that Gray puts a lot of the
> responsability on the reciever. How does a HumanML processor work? This
> is just out of my brain, probably wrong, but it does intrests me. So,
> just for discussion purposes...
>
> First scenario: The translation is on the sender side. "No one listens"
> translates by the Venusian agent to correct emotion "Need attention".
> Recieving side (the martian agent) handle this and because it's a
> venusian, a special venusian, it translates to actions "hug | give
> flowers | listen ..." and into a state of loving. Now, what would happen
> if this message, the event, from the vinusian wasn't interpretered as
> from someone special? The martian would falsle trigger actions like
> "reject | turn-away | get Scared ..." and perhaps put the martian agemt
> into a state of embarrassed or perhaps even hostile. Since the venusian
> agent is listening careful to state changes on this particular martian
> it would perhaps recieve a rejecting event back.
>
> Second scenario: The translation is on the receiving side. At point
> zero, the martian agent knows nothing but martian interpretations. It
> does recognize venusian events and handles accordingly. No translation
> is made other than based on historical data. After a while the martian
> agent learns to react differently to different venusians, or perhaps it
> even treats them all the same (what a disaster in its self:).
>
> Third scenario (the combination). Venusian agent does translation based
> on who the receiving agent is. It means that the agent isn't exactly in
> a broadcasting mode, but rather holding a session with the martian
> agent. The venusian agent learns to adjust it's events based on feedback
> from 1) the venusian pilot, 2) the martian agent. The martian agent
> learns that some events sent by venusian agents need further processing
> to get the expected result. It learns that "I love you" doesn't always
> should put it into a state of "loving". Exactly how it learns this, must
> be based on feedback from the venusian agent or it's pilot I guess.
>
> Scenario 1 and 2 builds into simple transision maps. Scenario builds
> into a neural network I guess...
>
>
> At least you know you have succeeded when the two agents start fighting
> :-)
>
> Cheers,
> /Niclas
>
>
>