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Subject: Re: [chairs] This Old House (OASIS) - Further Response to PeterBrown
On Fri, 30 Apr 2010, bill parducci wrote: > I believe that modern forum features include the ability to interact via > email as well as browser. This not only provides a natural archive mechanism > that is referenced in each message, but also a reasonable search mechanism > once you get there. +1 It's even an Internet standards track protocol: "The Archived-At Message Header Field" IETF Standards Track Request for Comments #5064 http://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc5064 In contexts where 'Archived-At' has been implemented, it appears to be very popular. It allows you to compose email messages or other documents from your laptop when you are not connected to the Internet: from your local email client message box, you can grab the 'Archived-At' URI for a message and construct a URI reference for the message that will resolve under DNS+HTTP. No need to have access to a server in order to ascertain the message URI in the archive. It's quite cool (though some would say "obvious", after they become familiar with the convention). - Robin Robin Cover OASIS, Director of Information Services Editor, Cover Pages and XML Daily Newslink Email: robin@oasis-open.org Staff bio: http://www.oasis-open.org/who/staff.php#cover Cover Pages: http://xml.coverpages.org/ Newsletter: http://xml.coverpages.org/newsletterArchive.html Tel: +1 972-296-1783 On Fri, 30 Apr 2010, bill parducci wrote: > I believe that modern forum features include the ability to interact via > email as well as browser. This not only provides a natural archive mechanism > that is referenced in each message, but also a reasonable search mechanism > once you get there. > > > b > > > On Apr 30, 2010, at 4:03 AM, Martin Chapman <MARTIN.CHAPMAN@oracle.com> > wrote: > >> Wouldn't it be great if each mail sent to a Tc list includes the url to the >> archive location of each mail! >> The problem with markmail, as Patrick hints at, is it's a separate copy. If >> you locate a mail in markmail, you still have to go into OASIS archives to >> get an OASIS URL >> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Patrick Durusau [mailto:patrick@durusau.net] >>> Sent: 29 April 2010 12:08 >>> To: robert_weir@us.ibm.com >>> Cc: chairs@lists.oasis-open.org >>> Subject: Re: [chairs] This Old House (OASIS) - Further Response to Peter >>> Brown >>> >>> Rob, >>> >>> Just popped back in to close the office down. >>> >>> On 4/28/2010 8:06 PM, robert_weir@us.ibm.com wrote: >>>> Patrick Durusau<patrick@durusau.net> wrote on 04/28/2010 07:15:15 PM: >>>> >>>>> On 4/28/2010 5:11 PM, robert_weir@us.ibm.com wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Oh, I think this is more like saying don't trust a house builder >>>>>> whose toolbox is not neatly organized. Maybe, maybe not. I think >>>>>> it is something that would need to be demonstrated, not assumed. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> OK, how many examples would count for a demonstration? >>>>> >>>>> >>>> Let's see if we can start with one good one. >>>> >>>> >>> OK, let's start at the OASIS homepage and go to the Committees by Name >>> page. >>> >>> Limiting ourselves to active TCs. >>> >>> Looking at the right hand menu bar, if you wanted to check on the most >>> recent activity of a TC, does >>> it seem likely you would choose the menu choice labeled "minutes?" >>> >>> Pick any three TCs and see what result you get. >>> >>> BTW, while you are at each of those TCs, you might want to see what you >>> get under Documents as well. >>> >>> You might want to also check on the FAQ link as well for the TCs. >>> >>> Having navigation links that consistently resolve to something useful for >>> all TCs isn't that high of a >>> bar. >>> >>> Having TCs consistently store their documents so that members of the >>> public can find them, isn't that >>> high of a bar. >>> >>>>> Give me a reasonable number and I will post them to this list, naming >>>>> names as it were. >>>>> >>>>> Here's one to get us started (although this is true across all TCs >>>>> that I am aware of): >>>>> >>>>> Follow this link to get ODF email archives: >>>>> >>>>> http://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/office/messages.php >>>>> >>>>> Now, follow this link to get ODF email archives: >>>>> >>>>> http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/office/ >>>>> >>>>> Do you notice anything different about those two pages? >>>>> >>>>> (Hint: You can search using MarkMail with the second one.) >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> From the public-facing perspective, the later URL is what is pointed >>>>> to >>>> from the TC's public-facing home page, so that is what I expect the >>>> public would use. The former URL is linked to from the >>>> password-protected Kavi page, so the public would not stumble on that >>>> page. The exception would be a TC member posted an email with a >>>> hyperlink to a URL from the private >>>> repository. Is that what you are seeing? I know we had a problem >>>> similar to that with doc repository links a while back. >>>> >>>> >>> Missing my point. >>> >>> The email documents in both cases are identical. >>> >>> Why shouldn't TC members when they are logged in have the same email >>> search capabilities (MarkMail) as >>> a member of the public? >>> >>> Doesn't it seem odd that we would point TC members, who have logged in, to >>> less search capabilities >>> for email? >>> >>>>> Err, would having a uniform way to access email archives, hopefully >>>>> MarkMail, be too much trouble? >>>>> >>>>> >>>> I assume that, for IPR documentation reasons at least, OASIS will >>>> always need to store their own copy of the emails. But I wonder if a >>>> URL rewrite rule in Apache could simply redirect the "private" URLs to >>>> the public copy? That would handle historic uses of the private URLs >>>> as well as future ones. >>>> >>>> >>> Well, yes, the MarkMail archive is a separate copy, probably for IPR >>> reasons. >>> >>> But that doesn't mean we need separate pages for search capabilities. cf >>> the default public page which >>> has both. >>> >>> Hope you are at the start of a great day! >>> >>> Patrick >>> >>> >>>> -Rob >>>> >>>> >>> >>> -- >>> Patrick Durusau >>> patrick@durusau.net >>> Chair, V1 - US TAG to JTC 1/SC 34 >>> Convener, JTC 1/SC 34/WG 3 (Topic Maps) >>> Editor, OpenDocument Format TC (OASIS), Project Editor ISO/IEC 26300 >>> Co-Editor, ISO/IEC 13250-1, >>> 13250-5 (Topic Maps) >>> >
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