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Subject: RE: [opendocument-users] Improvement submissions to the ODF-TC?


Thanks.  I am new to the list.  If my questions are shot down time will tell.

I didn't ask about process, I asked about content.  I am not focusing on individual's memories or what KDE did or didn't do 10 years ago, thanks.

When I asked a direct question I received some useful, direct replies.  The value of this list for information exchange has already been proven for me.  My thanks to those who provided this OASIS list.

I will say it once again, and that is it.  I will not be drawn into side issues, period.  I am not even going to answer them.  Feel free to discuss amongst yourselves.

Thanks to all who answered me with a response focused on my exact question.  I may have similarly direct questions in the future which will help me better understand standardization processes.  Regards, John


John C. Cody, Associate Counsel
Office of the NYS Chief Information Officer/NYS Office for Technology
[The statements expressed herein are my own and do not necessarily reflect the policies, practices or opinions of my employer or anyone else.  Nothing herein constitutes legal advice - if you need legal advice, please consult your own attorney.]

-----Original Message-----
From: marbux [mailto:marbux@gmail.com]
Sent: Friday, May 15, 2009 12:25 PM
To: robert_weir@us.ibm.com
Cc: opendocument-users@lists.oasis-open.org
Subject: Re: [opendocument-users] Improvement submissions to the ODF-TC?

On Fri, May 15, 2009 at 8:04 AM,  <robert_weir@us.ibm.com> wrote:

> Whether something was discussed and whether it was addressed or not is
> best determined by by reference to meeting agenda and minutes which
> are posted to the list.

John, Rob apparently had a forgetful moment. There were numerous occasions prior to Rob being anointed as co-chair when proposals never made it onto the TC agenda even as discussion items. There were also problems with agenda items falling off the agenda (repeatedly with one interoperability proposal by the KDE team to specify document settings to clear up the mess left by different implementations creating their own custom settings).

Memorable among those proposals that never made it onto the agenda are the five proposals submitted by Florian Reuter, now of Novell but previously CTO of the OpenDocument Foundation, aimed at removing interoperability barriers between ODF implementations and Microsoft Office. (The Foundation is no longer a going concern but I was its Director of Legal Affairs.) As I recall, three of those proposals were on the TC list and the other two were on the Metadata Subcommittee list.

Those particular procedural screw-ups were later defended by a Sun Microsystems TC member (don't recall which one at the moment) as being due to the fact that Florian had not used the magic word "proposal."
However, during my time on the TC, I saw many proposals processed that did not use the supposedly magic word. Indeed, use of the magic word was the exception rather than the rule prior to Rob's co-chairmanship.

I am surprised that Rob forgot the agenda problems while he was a TC member but before he became co-chair. They were highly controversial and as I recall he said that they were a motivating factor in his agenda reforms. (I don't recall at the moment whether that communication was on one of the ODF TC lists or on the OpenDocument Fellowship mailing list.)

Both I and one of my associates are very familiar with the TC's archives and could assist by providing you with links to relevant communications if they exist; however we would need a more specific description of the information you seek.

I'd be happy to help either on this list or by off-list email, but as I understand previous rulings, such a discussion would be off-topic for this list. So if you desire my assistance, off-list communications would best avoid the wrath of the resident censors.

Even discussion of the procedural limits imposed by international and federal law governing standards development work is deemed off-topic for the ODF TC mailing lists. Compare these two posts from the last 24 hours.  <http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/office-comment/200905/msg00028.html>
and <http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/office-comment/200905/msg00022.html>.

So it's probably better to communicate off-list about getting you the information you seek.

Best regards,

Paul E. Merrell, J.D. (Marbux)

Universal Interoperability Council

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